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Home My WebLink About20040812Volume I.pdfORIGINAL BEFORE THE IDAHO PUBLIC UTILITIES c-Ag~iqN 11M II: 5' IN THE MATTER OF UNION PACIFIC RAI LROAD 'S INTENT TO ABADON THE COEUR D' ALENE INDUSTRIAL LEAD FROM MP 2. 25 TO MP 7. 5 IN KOOTENAI COUNTY IDAHO. HEARING BEFORE . . - Ig~ ~ ~~i~ M~SI . UPR-R- 04- COMMISSIONER PAUL KJELLANDER (Presiding) Kootenai County Administration, Building Room 1B 451 Government Way Coeur d' Al ene Idaho PLACE: DATE:July 27 2004 VOLUME I - Pages 1 - 11 --- L.....! ..J L HEDRICK COURT REPORTING gel'e'(~ tk CQ/f(JK(Q(/~ &~ee 1978 POST OFFICE BOX 578 BOISE, IDAHO 83701 208-336-9208 For the Staff:SCOTT WOODBURY , Esq. Deputy At torney General 472 West Washington Boise , Idaho 83702 HEDRICK COURT REPORTING O. BOX 578, BOISE , ID APPEARANCES 83701 WITNESS EXAMINATION BY PAGE Michael Gridley (publ ic) Peter Cooper (publ ic) (No exhibi ts were marked. Mr. Woodbury Statement Commissioner Kj ellander Mr. Woodbury Statement Mr. Woodbury (Cross) HEDRI CK COURT REPORTINGP. O. BOX 578 , BOISE , ID 83701 INDEX EXHIBITS COEUR D'ALENE , IDAHO , TUESDAY , JULY 27 , 2004 , 1 :35 P. COMMI S S IONER KJELLANDER:Well , good afternoon. This is the time and place for a hearing in Case No. UPR-R- 04 -1, Notice of Intent to abandon a rail line from mile post 2.25 to mile post 7.5 in Kootenai County. My name's Paul Kj ell ander, and I'm the chairman of this hearing. And the purpose today is to take public testimony In relationship to the proposed abandonment.And it looks as if we'll have a relatively short and brief meeting today, as we have just two people signed up to testify. The way it wi II work is we have a podium here to the left and I bel ieve there's a microphone on, even though that will probably be overkill today.And what we'll do is call you up, and at that point I'll swear you in, and the attorney representing the Attorney General's office and the Staff of the Public Utilities Commission will just ask you a few brief questions to get you officially into the record.And then you'll be allowed to give your statement.And we'll start that in just a moment. First, we need to take the appearances of the parties , and we'll start wi th Mr. Woodbury. MR . WOODBURY:Scott Woodbury, Deputy Attorney HEDRICK COURT REPORTING O. BOX 578, BOISE , ID COLLOQUY 83701 General, and I represent the Commission Staff. COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay.And is there anyone representing Union Pacific here today that needs to be recognized for purposes of cross-examination? (No response. COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay.We wi II move forward then , and the first person we need to call Mike Gridley. MR. MICHAEL GRIDLEY:Thank you.My name is Mike Gridley. COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Mr. Gridley, could I get you to raise your right hand first? MICHAEL GRIDLEY appearing as a public witness, being first duly sworn , was examined and testified as follows: EXAMINATION BY MR. WOODBURY: Mike Gridley, spell your last name. It's G-R- I -E- Y . And your residence? Residence is 2913 Fernan Road, F-N Road. And that's in Coeur d'Alene? HEDRICK COURT REPORTING P. O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 GRIDLEYPublic Coeur d' Al ene . And are you speaking in a representative capaci ty today? m here wearing two hats , actually.I am.One, m City Attorney for the City of Coeur d'Alene , and I'm also a board member of the North Idaho Centennial Trail Foundation. You may give your statement. All right.Thank you. THE WITNESS:ve got two letters:One f rom on behalf of the City of Coeur d'Alene, and one signed by Chris Copstead who's chairman of the North Idaho Centennial Trail Foundation , both addressed to the Commission. COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Thank you. THE WITNESS:Both of those letters are in support of the abandonment. And the only additional plece that I would add is both entities that I'm here on behalf are also very supportive of rail banking of this line, and just wanted the Commission to know that there's a lot of interest in the use of these corridors or this particular corridor for public use al ternati ve transportation.The trail systems that have been done up here are very popular, and they've become a big tourist attraction and attracted a lot of people to this area and have been a boost to the economy, so this trail links - - would link with the existing centennial trail , which is a millennium HEDRI CK COURT REPORTING P. O. BOX 578, BOISE , ID 83701 GRIDLEY Public trail, the only millennium trail in Idaho. So we would strongly encourage any recommendation to the Surface Transportation Board or a communicating our support for that to the Surface Transportation Board. COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay.Before you go, we have an opportunity for questions.Let's start wi Mr. Woodbury and see if there are any questions. I have no questions.MR . WOODBURY:Thank you. EXAMINATION BY COMMI S S IONER KJELLANDER: Just one, and maybe you mentioned it.I may have missed it as I was trying to glance over the letters. Have you had an opportuni ty to contact Union Pacific in relationship to the rail banking proposal? We have talked to Union Pacific:Mike Sattler in the real estate department, talked to Mr. Clark also.They' aware of our desire. As I understand it, the corridor is owned in fee by the Railroad , so it would be something that they could sell. But they are supportive, as far as I know , of our desire to rail link the corridor. Good.Thank you.Thanks for your testimony. Thank you for your time. HEDRI CK COURT REPORTING P. O. BOX 578 , BOISE, ID 83701 GRIDLEY (Com)Public (The wi tness left the stand. COMMI S S IONER KJELLANDER:Call now Mr. Peter Cooper. PETER COOPER appearing as a public witness, being first duly sworn , was examined and testified as follows: EXAMINATION BY MR.WOODBURY: Mr.Coope r , spell your last name? will you please state your .full name Peter Cooper, C-O- P- And your address, sir? 1671 East Miles Avenue, Hayden, Idaho. Okay.You may give your statement. Yes. THE WITNESS:I am a long-term resident and have fought with this and done quite a bit of work on forming a railway - - short-line railway operating company to purchase this line, as well as several of the other ones in the neighborhood.I am concerned that I'm in the process of funding - - to making an offer and to fund the purchase of the rail line for mixed operations and a dual rail and trail HEDRICK COURT REPORTINGP. O. BOX 578, BOISE , ID 83701 COOPER Public proj ect Several states have rail and trail proj ects that are dearly appreciated and are extremely safe for the trail users.Out of the 61 trails that I am aware of that have been published by the Trail Conservancy that I have studied, there' only been two accidents involving inj uries wi th trains, which is a whole lot less of a risk than riding your bicycle on the roadways. So I support the trail , the use of that right-of-way as a trail.I just think that allowing me to purchase this rail line and operate a short-line freight operation as well as any kind of rail tourism and - - on the tracks , then I'm more than happy to cede over to the trail folks the unused portion of the right -of -way for them to use as they see fit as part of their foot path.Keeping in mind that the New Starts program offered by the Federal Government' Transportation Administration has generous matching funds for transi t -oriented uses, including tracks, maintenance of way, and various rail and passenger and cyclist used occupancy. in working wi th me, the Ci ty would be miles ahead in funding and maintaining this trail as part of the public domain even though I'm using the rail infrastructure for its intended purposes. And I implore the City to work with me on this instead of trying to rail bank it, in which case you tear up HEDRICK COURT REPORTING P. O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 COOPER Public the infrastructure and then there's a huge cost to putting back; whereas, what we have now is suitable for short-line low- speed freight service wi th a minimum of maintenance.And it would be money well spent to maintain that rail infrastructure as a way of assuring that we aren't going to have to spend a ton of money, millions of dollars in the future to put it back, because it's part of my rail proj ect maintain and get new customers. I am trying to develop the industrial park, rail service to the industrial park , and relocate the Stimson Lumber Company's mill which falls in line with the education corridor because they want to get the mill out of the way anyway.And that way I get the customers to have a profitable rail business, and we get the industrial use out of the downtown area for the addi tional North Idaho College campus and education corridor. And so there is several benefits to maintaining this rail service and giving me the opportunity to purchase this system and do my civic duty to cede over as promised the - - a portion of the rail bed to use as the trail system. COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay.Thank you. Are there any questions?Mr. Woodbury? HEDRICK COURT REPORTING O. BOX 578, BOISE , ID 83701 COO PER Publ i c CROSS - EXAMINATION BY MR. WOODBURY: Mr. Cooper , have you contacted Union Pacific? I have sent a Letter of Intent a couple years ago and they - - at the time, they replied back and said they weren't really thinking about selling it right away.But they gave me a figure which was ridiculous, and I think they have modified their price to the point where I'm willing to pay for it. And I'm - - in fact, I was told by a railway consultant in the business, not necessarily affiliated with the Union Pacific , that the line was going to be mothballed and therefore, it wasn't going to be abandoned. And this hearing was news to me.It hit me like ton of bricks. SO have No. you had any recent contact wi th them? MR. WOODBURY:No further questions. COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Thank you.And we appreciate your testimony today, Mr. Cooper.Thank you. (The wi tness left the stand. COMM IS S IONER KJELLANDER:That exhausts our very short list.Is there anyone else who is here for the purposes HEDRI CK COURT REPORTING O. BOX 578, BOISE , ID 83701 COOPER (X) Publ i c of providing testimony? If not, then we will make this mercifully quick and begin to wrap this proceeding up. As with regards to the letters that were presented, I'll go ahead and take those back.We'll make those an official part of our record. And just so that you understand our process, really as we look at State Statute, our jurisdiction is extremely limited; and, in fact, our primary purpose is to explore whether or not there's an adverse affect with the proposed abandonment if it were to go forward, and also to try to determine if there would be an impairment of access of Idaho shippers to vi tal goods and market, and whether the I ine has a potential for profitability.I f we find that one of those three criteria or all of those three criteria are somehow adversely affected, then the Commission would, in its -- on its own , find that the abandonment could be viewed as adversely affecting the area being served, and at that point we would merely intervene on behalf of the State of Idaho with the Surface Transportation Board. At this point, I don't see that there's any evidence that lines up towards those three criteria, and to the extent at least that I've heard correctly at this public hearing, Mr. Gridley has asked us if nothing more than just a letter of support to go forward with the Surface Transportation HEDRICK COURT REPORTING O. BOX 578 , BOISE , ID COLLOQUY 83701 Board in reference to what his desire is wi th that proj ect, if that's a correct characterization. MR. MI CHAEL GRIDLEY:That's correct, or just acknowledging that our testimony is that we are supportive the communi ty is supportive - - of that type of proj ect COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay.Well , good. Well , we appreciate your testimony today, and there being no further business to come before us at this point, we are adj ourned. (The hearing concluded at 1:47 p. HEDRI CK COURT REPORTING P. O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID COLLOQUY 83701 AUTHENTICATION This is to certify that the foregoing is a true and correct transcript to the best of my ability of the proceedings held in the matter of Union Pacific Railroad' intent to abandon the Coeur d' Alene industrial lead from MP 2.25 to MP 7. 5 in Kootenai County, Idaho, Case No. UPR-04-1, commencing on Tuesday, July 27 , 2004, at the Kootenai County Administration Building, Room 1B 451 Government Way, Coeur d'Alene, Idaho, and the original thereof for the file of the Commission. """""" " .i:~ ~~~ J. 1.(&":.. ~'f"" ~.;e, i I ~OT.\.t I- ~ "~*: ~.. . PlIBL\(. ~ ~ )I- .,., ~"" rli ~v ~ ,#, OF \1) ,"",......", WENDY J. MURRAY t ry Pub i c in and for the S ate of Idaho, residing at Meridian , Idaho. My Commission expires 2 -2008. Idaho CSR No. 475 HEDRICK COURT REPORTING O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID AUTHENT I CAT I ON 83701