CPRRVOL2.docx

1 CRAIGMONT, IDAHO, MONDAY, JUNE 19, 2000, 6:20 P.M.
2
3
4 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Good
5 evening, ladies and gentlemen. Can you hear me okay
6 in the back? Is the system on?
7 Great. Okay, there we are.
8 Well, good evening. This hearing will
9 now be in order. This is the time and place set by
10 the Idaho Public Utilities Commission for a public
11 hearing on Case No. CPR-R-00-1, also known As in the
12 matter of Camas Prairie RailNet's Application to
13 abandon the Spalding-Grangeville Branch in Lewis,
14 Idaho, and Nez Perce counties.
15 My name is Paul Kjellander; I'm a
16 member of the Commission and I'll be chairing
17 tonight's hearing. At my right is Commissioner
18 Marsha Smith, and to my left is Commissioner
19 Dennis Hansen. The three of us make up the entire
20 Commission.
21 Now, tonight's proceedings are unique
22 to the Railroad abandonment process. According to
23 Idaho State Code, the Commission's responsibility is
24 to review the abandonment based on three criteria.
25 The criteria are as follows:
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1 First, whether the abandonment would
2 adversely affect the area being served;
3 Second, whether it would impair the
4 access of Idaho communities to vital goods and
5 services, and market access to those communities;
6 And, third, whether the line has
7 potential for profitability.
8 If the Commission finds in the
9 affirmative of these criteria, then it will transmit
10 a report of its findings to the Surface
11 Transportation Board on behalf of the people of the
12 State of Idaho; and it would be helpful for the
13 purposes of tonight's hearing if your comments could
14 focus on those specific issues, those three criteria
15 that were previously outlined.
16 We have circulated a sign-up sheet,
17 and if you have not yet had an opportunity to sign
18 or decide later on that you would like to testify,
19 there will be ample opportunity, so don't feel that
20 you'll be left out. We'll stay until we've heard
21 from all of you.
22 Earlier today we began with the
23 technical hearing. We recessed that, and
24 immediately following the public hearing this
25 evening, we'll return to that technical hearing and
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1 wrap up testimony and cross-examination of that
2 witness.
3 What we need to do first is to begin
4 by taking the appearances of the parties, and we'll
5 begin with Counsel for Camas Prairie Railroad.
6 MR. HEFFNER: My name is John
7 Heffner. I'm an attorney with the Washington, D.C.,
8 firm of Rea, Cross and Auchincloss, and I represent
9 Camas Prairie RailNet.
10 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
11 Counsel for the Idaho Public Utilities Staff.
12 MR. HOWELL: For Commission Staff,
13 Don Howell, Deputy Attorney General, for the Staff.
14 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And United
15 Transportation Union of Idaho.
16 MR. MILLWARD: George Millward,
17 representing the Idaho Legislative Board and UTU
18 railroad workers.
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And is there
20 any other intervening party that we've missed to
21 tonight for purposes of cross-examination?
22 If not, are there any preliminary
23 matters that need to come before the Commission?
24 I believe earlier today we had heard
25 that Counsel for Camas Prairie RailNet might like to
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1 make a brief opening statement, and this would be
2 the time and place.
3 MR. HEFFNER: When I arrived earlier
4 today, I saw a sign that said basically, I -- let me
5 start again. When I arrived, I had word that the
6 shippers had submitted a filing on behalf of their
7 group called Save the Camas Prairie RailNet, or
8 something to that effect, or Save the Camas Prairie
9 Railroad; and so I want everybody to know that I too
10 am here to save Camas Prairie Railroad. What I am
11 referring to is the Camas Prairie Railroad Company;
12 in other words, my client.
13 And the thought that I want to convey
14 to everybody is that my client wants to work with
15 the shippers and the community and/or communities
16 and the elected officials to find a way to preserve
17 rail service while eliminating the deficit that we
18 are experiencing. Now, this could take any number
19 of forums, including transferring ownership of the
20 Railroad to some public agency, shipper association,
21 quasi-public/private partnership, eliminating the or
22 should we say ending real estate taxes on the
23 Railroad, shipper commitments that would achieve a
24 greater level of usage of the Railroad so that the
25 Railroad could be profitable, maybe having the State
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1 take over the responsibility for the bridge --
2 bridges and structures.
3 So I here -- I appear here in a
4 cooperative rather than in an adversarial role. And
5 I've represented many other short line railroads,
6 more commonly in acquisitions rather than
7 abandonments. I've represented public authorities
8 very similar to the State of Idaho, or subdivisions
9 in the state of Idaho. And so the bottom line is we
10 too would like to find a mutually-satisfactory
11 solution to this problem, but unfortunately, my
12 client can't afford to continue with a what
13 approaches a million dollar a year deficit.
14 And so I am looking for solutions. I
15 am available, I am accessible, and I'll give you my
16 phone number in D. C.: 202-785-3700. And I can
17 tell you that Camas Prairie RailNet's General
18 Manager Kevin Spradlin would be delighted to work
19 with people on a preservation of the Railroad, and
20 we are delighted to entertain proposals to subsidize
21 operations or to purchase the Railroad.
22 Thank you.
23 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
24 for your comments.
25 For the record, we make a full
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1 transcript of these proceedings, which means your
2 comments will be taken down by our court reporter,
3 and will be available for official review. The
4 Commission will consider all of your comments in its
5 deliberations on this case.
6 Now, as we proceed tonight, I'll call
7 your name from the sign-up sheet and ask you to come
8 forward. At that point, Commissioner Hansen will
9 ask you to raise your right hand, at which time
10 you'll be sworn in. If you could, please, as you
11 come forward, just come between the court reporter
12 and that table; there are some cables over here that
13 are taped down, but it would probably be easier for
14 you to come this way so you don't end up
15 accidentally tripping over some of that cabling.
16 And then what you'll need to do is go
17 over to that chair and sit down. The Staff
18 attorney -- Mr. Don Howell -- will ask you very few,
19 brief, preliminary questions; and at that point,
20 you'll be free to offer up your statement.
21 Once you've given your statement,
22 you'll be subjected to cross-examination, which
23 amounts to a possible follow-up question or two by
24 some of the other Intervenors at the front tables
25 here.
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1 With that, we'll move forward and call
2 our first witness, and the first witness this
3 evening will be State Representative Chuck Cuddy.
4
5 CHARLES D. CUDDY,
6 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
7 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
8
9 EXAMINATION
10
11 BY MR. HOWELL:
12 Q. Good evening, sir. Will you state
13 your name and spell your last for the record?
14 A. My name is Charles D. Cuddy,
15 C-U-D-D-Y.
16 Q. And, Representative Cuddy, would you
17 give us a business address?
18 A. Post Office Box 64, Orofino, Idaho --
19 O-R-O-F-I-N-O -- 83544.
20 Q. And do you hold a position in the
21 State Legislature?
22 A. I am a State Representative for
23 District 7, Idaho, which covers a majority of the
24 amount of the Camas Prairie RailNet proposed
25 abandonment.
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1 Q. And if you have a statement, we'd be
2 happy to hear it.
3 A. Thank you.
4 Q. Thank you.
5 THE WITNESS: Well, Chairman
6 Kjellander and Commissioner Hansen, Commissioner
7 Smith, it's nice to have the opportunity to come
8 before you. I guess my feelings are that I think
9 there's one other agency involved in this that
10 should have allowed us the same courtesy. Thank
11 you.
12 I've had a very brief period of time,
13 as you're probably all aware, to go over the
14 information forwarded from the National
15 Transportation Board -- in fact, I think I received
16 it in the mail last week -- and that gives me a very
17 limited amount of time without staff to research it.
18 I was a little bit surprised at the time of filing
19 when it came over a three-day weekend, which also
20 reduced the amount of time, in my estimation, people
21 2000 miles away had the opportunity to respond.
22 In -- my written testimony has the
23 same introduction in it, so I'll refrain from that.
24 But this route, if abandoned, will
25 leave these communities no alternative but highway
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1 transportation for delivery of goods and receipt of
2 commodities that we all are aware represents an
3 increased cost in doing business. Only two short
4 years ago, the Camas Prairie community felt that the
5 purchase of this Railroad represented long-term,
6 stable rail transportation for our area. One tends
7 to wonder if such short-term operation between
8 purchase and Petitioned abandonment was what
9 prompted this sudden proposal to abandon.
10 An interested individual, I cannot say
11 that I have observed any concerted effort to improve
12 or expand the service in lieu of shutdown. Review
13 of the few available documents leads me to believe
14 that the cost analysis presented by the Railroad
15 Company does not correctly represent fuel
16 consumption comparison between Railroad and highway
17 transportation.
18 It's vague to me how the composition
19 of a profitable Railroad operation is derived. It
20 seems to me that it certainly would not have been
21 out of order to have had access to a financial
22 analysis prepared by a qualified Idaho firm.
23 The environmental assessment was
24 prepared by a firm that states they are not
25 qualified to examine the Railroad property for
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1 possible hazardous waste deposits. It therefore
2 seems to me that, without question, in the event
3 abandonment is approved, that the Camas Prairie
4 should post substantial financial security with
5 Idaho DEQ that the cleanup will be both adequate and
6 take care of the hazardous material deposits that
7 possibly exist.
8 In the event of track or facility
9 removal, I do not find any mitigative proposal to
10 prevent air and water pollution, nor do I see a
11 guarantee that all wood structures will be removed
12 to ensure that future mitigative needs will not be
13 necessary. These important environmental issues may
14 need to be adequately addressed.
15 I simply cannot -- I simply am not
16 satisfied with produced documents that do not
17 adequately provide detailed financial justification
18 and tends to ignore environmental impacts that
19 scantily address economic impact to the affected
20 communities.
21 I could continue with my comments and
22 concerns, but at this point, I believe these local
23 abandonment procedures should be the responsibility
24 of the Idaho Public Utilities Commission that has a
25 far clearer grasp of the impact that remains at
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1 quandary. It should not be under the authority of a
2 bureaucratic entity that will neither extend the
3 courtesy or the concerns to view the affected area
4 and respectfully accommodate public testimony, or
5 leave many important issues affecting Idaho and its
6 citizens inadequately addressed.
7 Thank you, Mr. Chairman and
8 Commissioners.
9 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you,
10 Representative Cuddy. If you could stay seated,
11 we'll subject you to cross-examination. Let's begin
12 with Mr. Heffner.
13 MR. HEFFNER: Mr. Cuddy, I want to
14 thank you -- or, Representative Cuddy -- for
15 appearing, and sorry to disappoint you, I have no
16 questions to ask you. Thank you anyway.
17 THE WITNESS: Thank you. I'm not
18 disappointed.
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
20 MR. HOWELL: No questions.
21 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
22 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Oh, one
23 more. And Mr. Millward.
24
25
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1 CROSS-EXAMINATION
2
3 BY MR. MILLWARD:
4 Q. Representative Cuddy, how are you
5 doing today?
6 A. Good.
7 Q. Good seeing you again.
8 What city did you state you lived in?
9 A. Orofino, Idaho.
10 Q. Orofino. You say that you received
11 the information from the Surface Transportation
12 Board, the Application from Camas Prairie. Is that
13 what you received?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. I'm going to read a sentence, part of
16 a paragraph out of page 6 of that Application,
17 states The area adjacent to this line segment is
18 rural and sparsely settled, with a total population
19 around 7,000 people, with little likelihood of
20 producing significant new or additional business for
21 the Camas Prairie Railroad to make the line
22 profitable.
23 The three counties that lie in this
24 segment -- Nez Perce, Idaho, and Lewis -- do you
25 believe that there are more than 7,000 people that
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1 live in those three counties?
2 A. Mr. Chairman, Mr. Millward, if my
3 recollection is correct, I believe Idaho County
4 alone, the recent projected statistics for 2000 was
5 around 15,000 population in Idaho County; I believe
6 that Lewis County is approximately 3,800; I believe
7 that at Clearwater County is approximately 12,000 --
8 10- to 12,000, I'll correct -- 10,000; and of course
9 Nez Perce County is much larger. And it would
10 depend greatly on how you drew the area to get to
11 7,000 people. I know that Grangeville in my recent
12 research has approximately 3,200 people in the town
13 of Grangeville alone.
14 Q. So would you agree this line services
15 more than 7,000 people that the Applicant is saying
16 that it has an adverse effect on?
17 A. Mr. Chairman, Mr. Millward, I would
18 have to say that it would depend on how the Railroad
19 Company drew their area. Upon review of that, I
20 think if you saw what they had considered the
21 service area -- which I would consider to go as far
22 as Riggins at least and Elk City at least, so
23 basically you have all of Idaho County in that which
24 is 15,000 people -- but I would say that a review of
25 their service area might be in order from what
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1 you're telling me.
2 Q. Mister -- Representative Cuddy, in
3 their Order, they're going from a 1990 census of
4 nine cities alone, not counting any outstanding area
5 or rural area of the county; and there -- in their
6 Application, in the Applicant's Application, they're
7 stating that this rail line only services those
8 cities and small towns and communities.
9 My question is -- to you is do you
10 believe that this branch line services more than
11 just those communities and cities, and probably
12 parts of counties; farmers, fertilizer distributors
13 that don't live in these cities?
14 A. Mr. Chairman, Mr. Millward, I have a
15 written copy of my testimony, and in that, in the
16 heading, I list the number of communities just in
17 District 7 that provide service by this Railroad.
18 Some might be directly adjacent, some nonadjacent.
19 That list begins with Cottonwood, Craigmont,
20 Culdesac, Ferdinand, Lapwai, Reubens, Sweetwater,
21 directly served just in District 7.
22 Also, it serves Elk City and
23 Nez Perce, Idaho, which are also in District 7.
24 It also would serve Grangeville,
25 Riggins, White Bird, and a number of other
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1 surrounding communities that are not in Legislative
2 District 7.
3 So, I would say that that's a pretty
4 fair count of the communities it directly serves,
5 not to mention the fact that it goes into Lewiston.
6 So there is a service to Lewiston, Idaho, included
7 in that, should be included in that.
8 Q. So in the Applicant's Application,
9 there are more people being affected by this
10 abandonment Application than they've so claimed. Is
11 that correct?
12 A. Well, I would think so, and I would
13 think you would have to go to the City of Lewiston
14 to find out how many people in that town are
15 actually affected, and if -- in fact, some of my
16 problem with this is that we have a serviceable port
17 in Lewiston, Idaho. Once that grain is loaded on a
18 truck or some other vehicle, you're either going to
19 stop in Lewiston, is it going to go to Clarkston, is
20 it going to go to Kennewick or Pasco. That question
21 also remains unanswered.
22 Q. Okay. Thank you. I have no other
23 questions for you.
24 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
25 questions from the Commission?
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1 Representative Cuddy, thank you.
2 THE WITNESS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
3 And one thing additional: Senator Danielson asked
4 me to tell you that she couldn't be here, she has to
5 be in Boise, but she's pretty much said, Anything
6 Chuck Cuddy says, I agree with.
7 COMMISSIONER SMITH: Is there a time
8 limit on that?
9 THE WITNESS: In this particular case.
10 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
11 Thank you very much.
12 (The witness left the stand.)
13 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We'll call
14 our next witness: Mr. Vern Driver. If you would
15 please come forward and be sworn in.
16
17 VERN DRIVER,
18 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
19 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
20
21 EXAMINATION
22
23 BY MR. HOWELL:
24 Q. Good evening, sir. Could you state
25 your name and spell your last for the record?
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1 A. My full name is Vernon L. Driver,
2 D-R-I-V-E-R.
3 Q. And could you give us a residential or
4 mailing address?
5 A. 2989 Rudo Road, Orofino, Idaho.
6 Q. And do you represent any entity or
7 organization?
8 A. I am here on the behalf of Senator
9 McLaughlin.
10 Q. And please give us your statement.
11 THE WITNESS: I would like to,
12 Mr. Chairman, Commissioners, read a letter from
13 Senator McLaughlin concerning this issue. The
14 letter is dated June 15, 2000. It's to the Idaho
15 Public Utilities Commission, 607 North Eighth
16 Street, Boise, Idaho, 83702.
17 Dear Commissioners, with this letter,
18 I wish to convey my opposition to the closure of the
19 spur railroad line between Spalding and Grangeville,
20 Idaho. The economy of Central Idaho is at an
21 all-time low and the closures of the line between
22 Spalding and Grangeville, Idaho -- I'm sorry. The
23 economy of Central Idaho is at an all-time low and
24 the closure of the Railroad line would just add one
25 more nail in the coffin for the resources-based
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1 businesses that depend on the line to deliver their
2 product.
3 If this request from RailNet to close
4 the spur line is granted, additional freight costs
5 will prevail with no competitive sources, and
6 additional trucks will be used to deliver the
7 products. I sincerely believe that consideration
8 should be given to the impact additional trucks
9 hauling will add to the already inadequate highways
10 we have in this area.
11 Something needs to be done to
12 improve -- impress on the Federal Surface
13 Transportation Board that the large Railroad
14 Companies sell off the lesser-profitable spur lines,
15 making it easier for those smaller lines to close.
16 Clamps need to be put on up front, and I hope that
17 the Idaho Public Utilities Commission will rely on
18 this concern to the Board -- relay this concern to
19 the Board.
20 Rural areas need to have the ability
21 to thrive economically. Isn't that why the
22 Railroads were granted such large land holdings
23 originally: To contribute to the development and
24 economic growth of the rural areas?
25 Thank you for your consideration on
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1 this issue.
2 Sincerely, Marguerite McLaughlin,
3 Idaho Senator, District 7.
4 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And does
5 that complete your statement?
6 THE WITNESS: That completes my
7 statement.
8 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you,
9 Mr. Driver. Let's subject you now to
10 cross-examination.
11 Mr. Heffner.
12 MR. HEFFNER: No questions.
13 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
14 MR. HOWELL: No questions.
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Millward.
16 MR. MILLWARD: No questions.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Commissioners.
18 COMMISSIONER HANSEN: No, sir.
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
20 very much.
21 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
22 (The witness left the stand.)
23 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Let's call
24 Mr. Bruce Walker.
25
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1 BRUCE H. WALKER,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Could you state your name and spell
9 your last for the record, please?
10 A. My name is Bruce H. Walker,
11 W-A-L-K-E-R.
12 Q. And, Mr. Walker, do you have an
13 address for us, please?
14 A. Yes. It would be -- I'm representing
15 the City of Grangeville. The address would be 225
16 West North Street, Grangeville, Idaho.
17 Q. And do you have a statement?
18 A. Yes, I do. I'd like to read the
19 statement.
20 THE WITNESS: The Grangeville, Idaho,
21 City Council would like to go on record as opposing
22 the abandonment of the Camas Prairie RailNet between
23 Spalding and Grangeville.
24 The city of Grangeville is the end of
25 the rail system and will be affected by the loss of
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1 the alternate source of transporting major products
2 in and out of Grangeville. The price of
3 transportation of these products will be higher than
4 they are now because of less competition and the
5 fact that trucking, being the only other source of
6 transportation, it will cost more.
7 One of the major grain storage
8 businesses located in Grangeville -- the Union
9 Warehouse -- will be less competitive because of
10 fewer options they will have for shipping. This
11 could result in less business and less employment.
12 Bennett Lumber, a local timber
13 shipper, will be affected in the same way with more
14 cost due to shipping, and could also have the same
15 effects on business and employment.
16 The Railroad owns property in the city
17 of Grangeville. The tax base will be affected in
18 some way because of abandonment.
19 The main grain elevator and storage
20 unit -- Union Warehouse -- is accessed by city
21 streets that would have to be used by trucks for
22 transporting grain from the warehouse. These city
23 streets are not designed for the kind of regular
24 heavy traffic that trucks will impose if abandonment
25 occurs.
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1 One of the major trucking businesses
2 in Grangeville -- Baker Truck Service -- is located
3 far inside the city limits. They would more than
4 likely be one of the major haulers of grain if the
5 rail is abandoned. This would mean more trucks,
6 along with any other independent local truckers
7 using city streets that are not designed for this
8 kind of use.
9 The above-mentioned use of city
10 streets impacts the City of Grangeville's street
11 maintenance budget, costing everyone more money
12 because of rail abandonment.
13 Grangeville has struggled economically
14 for the past several years because of conditions out
15 of our control. We have lost over 250 jobs in our
16 local mill because of timber cuts on the National
17 Forest, not to mention other timber-related jobs.
18 Farming has become much more efficient, resulting in
19 fewer people being employed on the farms and farms
20 getting larger. Our remote location makes it
21 extremely difficult to attract new business.
22 Some of the advantages we do have are
23 biproducts of timber and agriculture. However,
24 these products result in high shipping costs. Our
25 ability to be competitive and attract new industry
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1 to Grangeville will be reduced substantially by rail
2 abandonment. Grain will still be produced on the
3 Camas Prairie and must be hauled to Lewiston, via
4 US Highway 95. This extra amount of truck traffic
5 will have a maintenance impact on the highway system
6 far beyond what it is now and will cost the
7 taxpayers more money because of rail abandonment.
8 US Highway 95 is the main route
9 between North and South Idaho. Lewiston is the
10 closest major city to Grangeville for business,
11 medical services, et cetera. This highway is the
12 route to the University of Idaho and LCSC for
13 student travel. The increase of truck traffic in
14 the thousands of trips per year will increase the
15 risk of near fatal and fatal accidents on this
16 highway because of abandonment.
17 With all these things considered --
18 the economic impact, the added cost and maintenance
19 on the highway and local road systems, and the
20 safety factor -- abandonment is not warranted at
21 this time. The Railroad has not proven that a
22 few -- that in a few short years of ownership and
23 claiming of loss of income they should be allowed to
24 abandon. We feel that even though the Rail claims
25 they have lost money over the past few years, they
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1 can break even or even make a profit through more
2 promotion and the use of the rail and more efficient
3 management. We feel the owners did know the income
4 being generated from this rail system when they
5 purchased it, and that they have done very little to
6 increase that potential in the short time of
7 ownership.
8 We feel that the economic impact this
9 would have on our city, and especially increased
10 danger to our citizens traveling Highway 95, far
11 outweigh the loss of income that the rail system
12 claims. We feel that it -- that if we are able to
13 produce more jobs because of rail shipments in and
14 out of Grangeville, the system should stay in place.
15 We also feel that no price can be placed on the
16 lives that would be at risk from unwanted and
17 increased dangers to our citizens from increased
18 traffic due to abandonment.
19 For all these reasons, which are fact,
20 I, Bruce H. Walker, president of the Grangeville
21 City Council, and representing the unanimous
22 decision of the City Council, oppose abandonment of
23 the Camas Prairie RailNet system between Spalding
24 and Grangeville.
25 That's my statement.
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1 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
2 And see if we have any cross-examination questions
3 from Mr. Heffner.
4
5 CROSS-EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HEFFNER:
8 Q. Mr. Walker, I just have one very short
9 question:
10 Do you have any idea how much the
11 additional highway expense would run per year?
12 A. No, but I'm sure that someone from the
13 Idaho Transportation Department could answer that
14 question.
15 Q. Thank you, sir.
16 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
17 MR. HOWELL: No questions.
18 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:
19 Mr. Millward.
20 MR. MILLWARD: No questions.
21 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Commission?
22 Thank you very much.
23 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
24 (The witness left the stand.)
25 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: George
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WALKER (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Patton?
2 Ah, we have a winner. Mr. Patton, if
3 you could come forward?
4
5 GEORGE PATTON,
6 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
7 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
8
9 MR. HOWELL: Good evening, sir.
10 THE WITNESS: Well, Commissioners, I
11 apologize. I -- apparently I've been out of town
12 for quite a while; just got back. I don't have a
13 prepared statement, but I've lived here for 65
14 years, been a producer of commodities, and the
15 Railroad, I had -- would have to -- I'm opposed to
16 abandoning the Railroad.
17 I'd have to agree with Senator
18 McLaughlin's statement that the rail lines received
19 this property through government reimbursement as
20 the lines first went in. It would be very
21 detrimental to the ag community that's already
22 suffering, and also, it also adds risk to our
23 highways, and the highways are -- have a struggle to
24 keep up with the transportation already.
25 I've been down to Phoenix about three
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING PATTON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 times this spring, and the truck traffic is bumper
2 to bumper, and you see all kind of very near misses
3 with that much truck traffic. And you don't have to
4 be a Harvard graduate to realize that if you abandon
5 the Railroad lines, we'd see an increase in truck
6 driving. When you see an increase in truck driving,
7 you see a frustration, and that ten percent or so
8 that -- whether it's cars or trucks that pass on --
9 on inadequate lanes, and more frequency to
10 accidents.
11 And so I leave you with I don't think
12 the idea of the Railroad was to make money on
13 abandonment and recycling. I think it would serve
14 the community much better with production for a --
15 helping the farm communities, because we're under
16 such stress right now.
17 And I leave you with a thought of
18 really examining what's going on, and if you have
19 just one more abandonment of a small community or
20 small communities, and if that's what the USA is all
21 about, well then give us a little tax relief.
22 Thank you.
23 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: If we could
24 have you hold on for just a moment, we do need to
25 get your name for the record. Mr. Howell is usually
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING PATTON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 a little quicker.
2
3 EXAMINATION
4
5 BY MR. HOWELL:
6 Q. You beat me to the punch.
7 A. Oh.
8 Q. Could you state your name and spell
9 your last name for the record?
10 A. George Patton, P-A-T-T-O-N.
11 Q. And, Mr. Patton, can you give us an
12 address?
13 A. Route 1, Box 2, Craigmont, Idaho.
14 Q. All right.
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Okay. Thank
16 you.
17 Are there questions for Mr. Patton,
18 Mr. Heffner?
19 MR. HEFFNER: No, sir.
20 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
21
22 CROSS-EXAMINATION
23
24 BY MR. HOWELL:
25 Q. Mr. Patton, how many acres do you
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING PATTON (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 farm?
2 A. Well I just retired this last year,
3 but I was farming around 2,500 acres.
4 Q. And what did you grow?
5 A. Wheat, peas, barley, lentils, canola,
6 Kentucky bluegrass.
7 Q. And did you ship any of those grains
8 on the Railroad?
9 A. Yes, I did. Barley market is really
10 dependable on the Railroad because we raise malting
11 barley and that's really important; and as a big
12 year rolls around like this year, it looks like
13 we're going to have a tremendous yield hopefully,
14 why then the rail becomes that much more important
15 to have it to get the commodity so that you can
16 continue to harvest. I mean, it's really essential,
17 because you've got to have everything -- all your
18 ducks in order to get -- get the crop off the field.
19 Q. Isn't it true that malt barley is
20 exclusive dependent -- exclusively dependent on rail
21 shipments because the barley shop will only accept
22 rail car shipments?
23 A. That's right, because of
24 contamination. It's real important. So you need to
25 keep it isolated and so it's really important.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING PATTON (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 And the amount of -- you know, we are
2 in an environment where we have, you know -- where
3 we're trying to work with environmentalists, and as
4 we increase truck traffic, we increase smog and so
5 we -- I mean, as we abandon one thing, we increase
6 something that we're working to cut down on, so it
7 all -- we have a lot of tools out there and they're
8 going to throw their tools away, then we're --
9 really, our backs are against the wall.
10 Q. Thank you. I have no further
11 questions.
12 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Millward.
13 MR. MILLWARD: No questions. Thank
14 you.
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Questions
16 from the Commission? Commissioner Hansen.
17
18 EXAMINATION
19
20 BY COMMISSIONER HANSEN:
21 Q. Sir, my question is you stated you had
22 several different products that you raised?
23 A. Right.
24 Q. And you mentioned the barley you ship
25 by rail. Do you ship all of your produce by rail or
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING PATTON (Com)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 do you currently -- have you shipped -- used the
2 trucks to ship some of your goods?
3 A. I have used trucks on some, but the
4 peas, lentils, barley, and then especially all the
5 wheat that goes in the elevators, you know, in town,
6 that all goes by rail. I have some farm storage and
7 that. Sometimes, if we get a good deal from a
8 Railroad and the warehouses, we can ship by rail;
9 otherwise, sometimes it goes by truck.
10 Q. So are you saying that in some cases
11 it's more economical for you to ship by truck than
12 rail right now?
13 A. Well, it's just a means of getting it
14 out. But I don't think it's any more economical. I
15 mean, you have a truck and you have storage, and you
16 have to put it through an elevator. If it's in the
17 elevator already, no, but because the elevator
18 capacity and because of a truck that's sitting
19 around, you do -- it's just a means of getting it to
20 a market. But our markets that take in the barley
21 and the peas and the lentils and most of the wheat
22 is done by rail with a little bit going by truck,
23 and the little bit that I ship by truck, they
24 wouldn't even notice me on the highway.
25 Q. Thank you.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING PATTON (Com)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And there
2 are no further questions, so we appreciate your
3 testimony.
4 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
5 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
6 (The witness left the stand.)
7 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Call
8 Matt Miller.
9
10 MATTHEW MILLER,
11 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
12 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
13
14 EXAMINATION
15
16 BY MR. HOWELL:
17 Q. Would you state your name and spell
18 your last for the record, please?
19 A. Matthew Miller, M-I-L-L-E-R.
20 Q. And, Mr. Miller, do you have an
21 address for us, please?
22 A. Yes. I'm representing Congressman
23 Helen Chenoweth-Hage today, 1727 Longworth House
24 Office Building, Washington, D.C., 20515.
25 Q. And would you please give us the
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MILLER
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Congressman's statement?
2 A. Thank you.
3 THE WITNESS: Mr. Chairman, I ask that
4 this written statement be allowed to be submitted
5 into the record.
6 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: (Indicating.)
7 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
8 I thank the Idaho Public Utilities
9 Commission for holding this hearing today to review
10 the proposed abandonment of Camas Prairie RailNet
11 line from Spalding to Grangeville, Idaho. I
12 appreciate the Commission for allowing me the
13 opportunity to submit written testimony on this
14 very, very important issue.
15 Today, the people of Idaho are faced
16 with a very difficult situation as CSPR attempts to
17 abandon the rail line. After reviewing reports and
18 visiting with members of Idaho's agricultural and
19 lumber industries, local government officials, and
20 concerned citizens, it is quite clear that
21 abandoning the rail line would constitute a major
22 step backward for Idaho's local economy. The
23 negative impacts of the abandonment would be
24 especially apparent in Idaho, Lewis, and Nez Perce
25 counties, whose livelihoods are mainly dependent
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MILLER
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1 upon agricultural and resource industries.
2 More specifically, granting CSPR the
3 authority to abandon the only rail line between
4 Spalding and Grangeville could potentially, one,
5 increase unemployment in the state, especially for
6 those individuals living in Idaho County where the
7 unemployment rate climbed to nearly 10.8 percent in
8 1999, the fifth highest in the state;
9 Two, discourage companies from
10 investing in the area;
11 Three, eliminate what is now one of
12 the cheapest forms of transportation for many
13 agriculture producers and shippers -- timber
14 shippers;
15 And, four, increase traffic congestion
16 on our roads, since many individuals will become
17 wholly reliant on truck transportation.
18 According to members of Idaho's grain
19 industry, abandonment of the rail line could
20 increase costs for many barley and wheat producers
21 in Northern Idaho, especially. In fact, press
22 reports indicate Idaho growers may have to spend
23 three cents to five cents more per bushel to
24 transport their commodities by truck in Idaho. This
25 is significant, since the wheat production was
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MILLER
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 approximately 13.6 million bushels, and the barley
2 production amounted to nearly 2.4 million in Idaho,
3 Lewis, and Nez Perce counties during 1999.
4 To complicate matters even further,
5 Shearer Lumber of Grangeville, Idaho, has informed
6 me that it could incur additional costs of up to
7 $100,000 if it loses access to the CSPR line.
8 Although CSPR asserts it does not
9 generate sufficient revenue to warrant its
10 retention, it is my belief that maintaining the rail
11 line has the potential to support an expanding
12 market and bring prosperity to the area and the
13 operators of the line. In fact, reports indicate
14 rail traffic between Spalding and Grangeville has
15 increased since CSPR acquired the line from
16 Burlington Northern, Sante Fe, and Union Pacific in
17 April 1998. According to the Idaho Transportation
18 Department, the number of carloads on the CSPR line
19 increased by approximately 530 between 1997 and
20 1999, and projections show that the CSPR carloads
21 may increase 3,200 in the next year.
22 Given these circumstances, the Idaho
23 Congressional delegation sent a letter to the
24 Surface Transportation Board in April 2000 to
25 request that it hold an oral hearing in the state of
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MILLER
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Idaho should CSPR file an Application to abandon the
2 line. Although STB indicates that it will not hold
3 a hearing in the state of Idaho, you have my word
4 that I will continue to pressure STB to carefully
5 monitor and review this situation.
6 I am working with Representative
7 Bud Shuster, Chairman of the House Transportation
8 and Infrastructure Committee, as well as
9 Representative Thomas Petri, Chairman of the House
10 Transportation and Infrastructure Subcommittee on
11 Ground Transportation, to ensure that STB works with
12 Idaho's concerned citizens, the agricultural and
13 resource communities, and CSPR to develop
14 mutually-beneficial solutions for all parties
15 involved.
16 Thank you very much.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
18 questions for Mr. Miller, Mr. Millward?
19 MR. MILLWARD: No.
20 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
21 MR. HOWELL: No.
22 MR. HEFFNER: No, thank you.
23 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And the --
24 none from the Commission.
25 Thank you.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MILLER
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
2 (The witness left the stand.)
3 Jessica Wade.
4 MS. JESSICA WADE: Commissioner,
5 everything that I would want to say has already been
6 said, and I pass.
7 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
8 very much.
9 Also, if other people feel the same as
10 Jessica Wade and don't feel like they want to
11 testify after they signed up, there is an
12 opportunity at the back of the room where Ron Law is
13 currently standing -- Ron, if you could just
14 waive -- we have some sheets back there if you'd
15 like to put a written testimony together, and that
16 will also be included as the official record.
17 Call Representative Twila Hornbeck.
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MILLER
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 TWILA HORNBECK,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Good evening. Could you state your
9 name and spell your last for the record, please?
10 A. My name is Representative Twila
11 Hornbeck, H-O-R-N-B-E-C-K.
12 Q. And, Representative, do you represent
13 which Legislative District?
14 A. I represent Legislative District 8.
15 Q. And eight encompasses portions of the
16 line currently under consideration?
17 A. Yes, Idaho County, a portion.
18 Q. Please give us your statement.
19 A. Thank you.
20 THE WITNESS: Commissioners of the
21 Idaho PUC, I am here tonight to ask that you deny
22 the Petition of the Camas Prairie Railroad to
23 disband operations from Spalding, Idaho, to
24 Grangeville, Idaho. My constituents are also here
25 today to make the case of the economic dependency of
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING HORNBECK
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 the Camas Prairie on the rail transportation.
2 We are a rural area, and that is now
3 extremely economically depressed. This has happened
4 over time for diverse reasons. There have been
5 years of slowdowns, and major roadblocks in timber
6 harvesting. This has been largely because of the
7 many environmental plans imposed on the Pacific
8 Northwest. We have major problems in the field of
9 agriculture. We are a resource-based economy. We
10 have lost that base to a great extent. Now we are
11 told to live on tourist-based economy. We cannot
12 survive, raise families, and live anywhere near the
13 life style that we were accustomed to on minimum
14 wage jobs.
15 I think this letter to the editor by a
16 senior at the Grangeville High School sums up pretty
17 well what the outlook for this area's people is:
18 After reading the May 9th article on
19 the roadless plan, I started adding up the stories
20 in your paper that deal with negative impacts on
21 local economies and find it pretty scary. The
22 roadless issue, dam breaching, Railroad abandonment,
23 low farm prices all seem to be combining to bring
24 down the structure of this area at the same time.
25 I'm wondering what is going to be left
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING HORNBECK
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 in North Idaho to keep young people here.
2 E-commerce? You can't even get a decent transfer
3 rate with the outdated phone lines. I can only hope
4 that sometime soon the planks will stop being pulled
5 out from under us and the shoring up will begin. I
6 am a senior at Grangeville and still hopeful.
7 Joe Fowler.
8 We need rail transportation to help us
9 lure new industry here to replace the lost resources
10 of employment.
11 Thank you for coming to Craigmont to
12 hold this hearing. We are grateful and appreciative
13 of any help to retain this link to the world that
14 you can insert in your recommendations.
15 Thank you.
16 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
17 questions of Representative Hornbeck?
18 MR. HEFFNER: No.
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We do have a
20 question from Commissioner Smith, who won't let you
21 get away that quickly.
22 COMMISSIONER SMITH: Representative
23 Hornbeck, I just wish to express that it would be my
24 sincere desire that this Commission would have the
25 authority to make the decision whether or not this
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1 line gets abandoned; but, unfortunately, although
2 this portion of line resides entirely within the
3 state, the Commission's jurisdiction of authority
4 over Railroads has systematically been stripped away
5 by Congress and the decision-making power in this
6 matter rests with the Surface Transportation Board
7 in Washington, D.C., who, as we know, will not even
8 come out and listen to you or your constituents. So
9 I wish that was our power, but it's not.
10 THE WITNESS: I know that,
11 Commissioner Smith, and I only hope that they will
12 listen to what we put into the record and your
13 recommendations, and the economic reality of our
14 area.
15 Thank you.
16 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
17 (The witness left the stand.)
18 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Well I've
19 done fairly well with names this evening, but I'm
20 going to strike out here: Mary Hasenoehrl.
21
22
23
24
25
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING HORNBECK
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 MARY HASENOEHRL,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. You probably know the drill: State
9 your name and spell your last for the record.
10 A. My name is Mary Hasenoehrl,
11 H-A-S-E-N-O-E-H-R-L.
12 Q. And do you have a business address?
13 A. I do. It's 111 Main Street, Lewiston,
14 Idaho, and I'm here representing US Senator
15 Mike Crapo.
16 THE WITNESS: I will be very brief,
17 because it is important that we hear from everyone
18 here.
19 US Senator Mike Crapo would like to
20 thank the Idaho Public Utilities Commission for
21 holding this hearing. It is important that IPUC
22 hear from everyone affected -- everyone affected if
23 the abandonment of Camas Prairie RailNet between
24 Grangeville and Spalding occurs. This is a very
25 important decision and will have a definite impact
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P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 on this region.
2 Again, Senator Mike Crapo wants to
3 thank everyone for taking time to discuss this very
4 important issue, and the IPUC for realizing the
5 importance of holding an oral hearing in our region.
6 Thank you.
7 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
8 questions?
9 If not, thank you very much.
10 Oh, we do have a question.
11 MR. HEFFNER: I merely want to thank
12 the Senator for appearing through you, speaking on
13 behalf of Camas Prairie RailNet, and as I said to
14 Representative -- I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing it
15 correctly -- Chainoweth (phonetic) --
16 THE WITNESS: Chenoweth.
17 MR. HEFFNER: Close? Okay.
18 -- we would like to meet with you,
19 either my client, should we say in what in
20 Washington, D.C., they call the District, or in my
21 case in Washington, with the Senator or his Staff to
22 see if some accommodation -- if things can't be
23 worked out.
24 THE WITNESS: Thank you. I'll express
25 that to him. Thank you.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING HASENOEHRL
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
2 for your testimony.
3 (The witness left the stand.)
4 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We'll call
5 now Ron Frei.
6
7 RON FREI,
8 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
9 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
10
11 EXAMINATION
12
13 BY MR. HOWELL:
14 Q. Good evening, sir. Could you please
15 state your name and spell your last name for the
16 record?
17 A. Ron C. Frei, F-R-E-I.
18 Q. And, Mr. Frei, where do you reside?
19 A. Route 1, Box 66, Grangeville.
20 Q. And do you have -- do you represent
21 any entity or organization?
22 A. I'm representing myself, as a
23 producer, and the Idaho County Farm Bureau.
24 Q. We'd be pleased to have your
25 statement.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING FREI
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 THE WITNESS: So as to not be --
2 Chairman and Commission, so as to not be competitive
3 (sic), I will just touch on a few things that I
4 think some of the other producers didn't.
5 Our organization is very concerned
6 about the safety, of course, on the highway and the
7 fact that it is estimated it would take between 10-
8 and 12,000 additional trucks to make up for the rail
9 not being there. That would undoubtedly create a
10 rate increase to encourage that many trucks to even
11 think about coming in. When you put that many
12 trucks on an already beat up highway, it would be
13 pretty devastating.
14 Another thing, we are concerned about
15 the noxious weed problem that could very well result
16 from the abandoned rail bed. And a lot of the
17 materials used in the early construction had
18 hazardous materials in them. Who is liable for the
19 hazardous materials, for the noxious weeds, for the
20 bridges?
21 I am also a barley producer of brewery
22 barley, and if we lose the rail, of course it looks
23 like we would lose that cash market for us, as well
24 as lentils.
25 We sure hope there is some way that we
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING FREI
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 can keep the railway there.
2 I thank you.
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
4 for your statement. Are there any questions?
5 Commissioner? Commissioner Smith has
6 a question.
7
8 EXAMINATION
9
10 BY COMMISSIONER SMITH:
11 Q. Yes, I was curious if the Rail -- if
12 the Railroad Company had approached you or any
13 members of the Idaho County Farm Bureau before its
14 decision on abandonment to find out if you could
15 ship more or time your shipping better or somehow
16 increase their efficiency and cut their costs?
17 A. No one contacted us directly. I mean,
18 we were asked through some representatives that,
19 Would you be willing to chip in a little more in
20 freight costs, and we said, Yes, but --
21 Q. Okay. Thank you.
22 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Frei, I
23 think that completes our questions. I was hoping
24 though if you could just answer one question: Does
25 the Commission have a copy of your letter?
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING FREI (Com)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 THE WITNESS: Yeah.
2 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We do?
3 THE WITNESS: I mean, I'll leave it
4 here.
5 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
6 That will be very fine. Thank you.
7 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
8 (The witness left the stand.)
9 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: If we could
10 call Senator Lin Whitworth.
11
12 LIN WHITWORTH,
13 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
14 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
15
16 EXAMINATION
17
18 BY MR. HOWELL:
19 Q. Senator, could you state your name and
20 spell your last name for the record, please?
21 A. My name is Lin Whitworth, L-I-N -- get
22 that right -- W-H-I-T-W-O-R-T-H-, and I'm from
23 Inkom, Idaho, I-N-K-O-M.
24 Q. And, sir, what is your occupation or
25 former occupation?
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WHITWORTH
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 A. I was a conductor on the Railroad for
2 43 years. I'm now a State Senator in District 33
3 down in Southern Idaho.
4 Q. And do you have a statement, sir?
5 A. Yes, I do.
6 THE WITNESS: Some -- thank you. I
7 appreciate the Commission and the Staff in allowing
8 this hearing. It's a privilege to be here.
9 I want to say that I may sound at
10 times like I'm getting away from this, your
11 instructions on speaking to the subject, but I'm
12 really -- if it sounds that way, it will be very
13 brief and it's just to make a point to give some
14 broad description of why I believe that this rail
15 abandonment shouldn't happen.
16 I'd like to point out right in the
17 beginning that I can't speak for the State Senate or
18 the House, but I can say that they did pass Senate
19 Joint Memorial 110 that was brought -- introduced to
20 us by Senator McLaughlin, which does state the
21 position of the Idaho State Legislature is the same
22 as you've been hearing here tonight, that they do
23 want -- they do want a hearing, they do want this to
24 be taken into very serious consideration by the
25 Transportation Board, and they too appreciate the
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P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 consideration that we've been given here.
2 Having worked in the transportation
3 system since I was about 17 years old -- for 50
4 years, practically -- I -- I've watched the changes
5 that have been made, and some of them are very
6 disappointing, and it's been very frustrating as a
7 railroader to watch the transportation system
8 deteriorate as it has in the state of Idaho. We've
9 had to stand by and watch while it was allowed to
10 deteriorate from a world-class example in the 1940s
11 to a system today that can't even move the produce
12 from our farms and to the markets during the
13 harvest; and also at one time a world leader in
14 moving passenger transportation, passengers on
15 trains, and it's deteriorated to almost nonexistent
16 in the state of Idaho for passenger service. In
17 Eastern Idaho, Southern Idaho, where we have the
18 population down there, we don't have a passenger
19 system. Now, I know that has nothing to do with
20 this rail line, but it's the same principle. It
21 needs to be talked about, it needs to be looked at
22 and considered.
23 I've watched over the last 30 years as
24 the Railroad has discontinued service and
25 abandonment and removed branch lines that served the
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WHITWORTH
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 very heart and soul of our agriculture, mining, and
2 timber industries. I worked on the branches that
3 come up to -- from Weiser to New Meadows and from
4 Nampa to McCall and all the branches in Eastern
5 Idaho, from Pocatello to Butte, Montana, and I've
6 watched the deterioration of the transportation
7 system there. They're not serving the people.
8 They're not serving the people like they was -- it
9 was assumed that they would when they were given the
10 rights-of-way, when they were helped by the
11 government and by tax dollars of our forefathers to
12 produce, to build, a rail system, and now they let
13 us down. They won't even move our produce to the
14 markets when we're in our harvest times. And this
15 is serious. We need to -- we need to be considered.
16 I watched on the branch lines as
17 family-owned elevators and shipping institutions and
18 co-ops were forced out of business when these
19 carriers were allowed to discontinue service such as
20 is being requested here and abandon the lines that
21 served the Idaho's rural communities.
22 It's past time. It's past time that
23 we stopped, we stop this deterioration of our
24 transportation system and turn around and head the
25 other direction. Let's start putting it back
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WHITWORTH
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 together. Let's start rebuilding the transportation
2 system so we can move everything and move it safe.
3 And as Representative Cuddy pointed
4 out so eloquently, that to force it -- to force it
5 off of the rails and onto the highways where the
6 taxpayer has to build the right-of-way and maintain
7 the highways, and it creates the hazard that we have
8 faced on Highway 95 -- down in my district I have
9 Highway 30 from McCammon to Inkom. At times there's
10 200 trucks an hour on a highway just like 95, only
11 we don't have any truck turnout. It's one of the
12 worst places in the nation for killing people. And
13 when you have a car or truck accident, it's
14 generally more deadly, it's more severe, and the
15 person in the automobile generally gets the worst of
16 the deal.
17 I worked locals and beet runs in my
18 younger days when I was instructed by trainmasters
19 to give poor service, to quit giving good service.
20 You could quarrel with them and they would insist.
21 I want to give you one instance, just to give an
22 example. It happened many, many times, but one
23 example was I was on the Burley-Declo -- I was on
24 the Burley switcher, and I'd go out there every
25 night, every single night, six nights a week, and
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1 switch out 12, 13 cars of grain from one shipper.
2 And they'd come into Burley, they'd go on the TFX to
3 the main line, and go to Ogden. And one night the
4 trainmaster come to me and says, You're only going
5 out there three days a week.
6 I said, You can't do that. He don't
7 have room. You can't do that. He don't have the
8 track space.
9 And he says, Well, he'll just have
10 to -- on the other three days a week, he'll just
11 have to haul it into Burley and by truck and load it
12 onto car in here.
13 Now, that's the attitude. It was only
14 nine miles for him, but it was the idea.
15 And I said, I don't know about that.
16 But anyway, I told the shipper what
17 the trainmaster told me.
18 He says, Well, you go back and tell
19 your trainmaster if I load that on a truck, it's
20 going to go over the hill to Ogden. I won't use his
21 railroad.
22 So that's the kind of things that have
23 created the situation where the Railroad can then
24 say, Well, we're not making no profit; but, however,
25 while they weren't making any profit, they was
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1 making million dollar bonuses to their CEOs with
2 stock options and all these things. Them continued,
3 but they weren't making any profit.
4 So the thing -- the point out there is
5 that whatever you hear from the Railroads and these
6 big businesses and these big conglomerates, you have
7 to examine it very closely. I mean, we've got to
8 really take a good look at it, because I know that
9 when I was working the TFX from Twin Falls to
10 Pocatello, a train that was not supposed to be
11 making any profit, I was taking a million dollars a
12 night in revenue off of that branch, every day. So
13 I wasn't too concerned about their profits, and
14 especially when they continued to make an increase
15 in profits each quarter.
16 And they done the same thing with
17 passenger service: They deliberately degraded it so
18 that people would quit using it so they could say,
19 Well, we're not -- now we really need passenger
20 service for the old, for mothers with children, some
21 people can't travel, some people can't fly. They do
22 need passenger -- we do need the passenger system.
23 And that's my testimony, Mr. Chairman
24 and Commissioners. I would -- I could go on all
25 night. All I've got to do is start talking sand
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WHITWORTH
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 house talk like they call it on the Railroad and we
2 could be here for a long time, but with that, I'll
3 quit.
4 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
5 questions of Senator Whitworth?
6 MR. MILLWARD: Mr. Chairman, I have
7 just one.
8
9 CROSS-EXAMINATION
10
11 BY MR. MILLWARD:
12 Q. Senator Whitworth, I haven't heard a
13 moving statement like that since the last time I
14 went to church when you spoke at a funeral, and I
15 want to thank you for thank.
16 A. Thank you, George. I hope this ain't
17 a funeral.
18 Q. I hope this ain't a funeral either.
19 Mister -- Senator Whitworth, you made
20 a comment that you'd been around the Railroad and
21 saw many other abandonments throughout the state of
22 Idaho. Is that correct?
23 A. Yeah. Yes, sir.
24 Q. And everyplace that there's been
25 abandonment have had very severe and adverse effect
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WHITWORTH (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 on the community. Is that what you'd say?
2 A. Absolutely. Many, many places. I can
3 give you some examples, like the Ketchum branch used
4 to go up to Sun Valley, from Shoshone, Idaho, up to
5 Sun Valley, and then another branch off of it at
6 Richfield that went over to Hill City, and it was
7 sort of similar to this branch -- or, to this
8 Railroad here where there was a grain elevator every
9 ten miles, and they're all gone. And they was
10 family-owned businesses and co-ops in the small
11 communities out there. Those businesses all failed
12 and went and disappeared. And it has -- it does
13 have an adverse effect on these communities and
14 forces what traffic and what grain is raised there
15 now goes on the highway and it creates a hazard to
16 the people on the highway. It's --
17 And rail is, as Cuddy pointed out,
18 save so much fossil fuel. We can move them on --
19 move that grain on rail so much cheaper if we can
20 just get it to the main lines and get it on the
21 trains and get it headed to wherever the destination
22 is.
23 Q. So from your experience, you're saying
24 with this abandonment being granted, it will have an
25 adverse effect on the citizenship?
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WHITWORTH (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 A. There's no question about that it
2 would have a terrible effect.
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Other
4 further questions?
5 Senator, thank you.
6 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
7 (The witness left the stand.)
8 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We'll call
9 Ralph Mathison.
10 MR. RALPH MATHISON: I didn't sign up
11 to give testimony tonight.
12 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Okay. How
13 about Mary Ann Mathison?
14 MS. MARY ANN MATHISON: I signed one
15 more.
16 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Okay. Well
17 it's good to see you anyway.
18 Todd Marett or Marek.
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING WHITWORTH (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 MICHAEL TODD MAREK,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 THE WITNESS: Thanks a lot for --
6
7 EXAMINATION
8
9 BY MR. HOWELL:
10 Q. Could you state your name and spell
11 your last for the record?
12 A. Michael Todd Marek, M-A-R-E-K.
13 Q. And, Mr. Marek, can you give us an
14 address?
15 A. 158 East Main, Grangeville.
16 Q. And do you represent any entity or
17 organization?
18 A. The Grangeville Economic Management
19 Team.
20 Q. All right. Thank you.
21 THE WITNESS: First of all -- oops.
22 First of all, I'd like to say, as you've probably
23 heard from the others, that many of the small
24 communities in Idaho County are suffering greatly
25 from all the loss of jobs we've had the last couple
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MAREK
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 years; and I know a lot of people say that a lot of
2 this is just progress and this is change, and I
3 think we realize that, but -- and I think we can
4 overcome a lot of the change and head towards
5 progress, but we can't lose the last few tools we
6 have to do that.
7 And right now, I know a lot of the
8 towns are struggling. There's a lot of civic groups
9 working hard to try to develop new business and try
10 recruit new business, and we just -- the rail is
11 probably the most important asset we have. When
12 you're located in Central Idaho, shipping is always
13 one of the biggest concerns on any type of
14 manufacturing or any type of product development,
15 and if we lose the last -- really the last main
16 thread we have, it's really going to hurt us.
17 I guess -- I guess I also feel that
18 in -- right now, you know, we're kind of -- we are
19 struggling, the whole area is struggling and all the
20 economies are real low, and I'm sure maybe that's
21 one of the reason some of the numbers are down for
22 the rail, but we all know that, you know, there's
23 bumps in the road and right now we're down in a low
24 area, and I think if we keep working and we get our
25 economies going better, we're going to be able to
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MAREK
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1 add more -- hopefully more shipping numbers to the
2 rail. And I think it's basically just because we
3 hit the first bump in the road, to abandon the rail
4 is the worst possible thing to do. I think if we
5 hang in there and everybody keeps working and when
6 the economy is strong again, I'm sure the shipping
7 numbers will be up again and everybody will prosper.
8 I think our forefathers had a lot of
9 insight when they allotted all the land for the
10 rails, and they didn't do that just so that Railroad
11 Companies could make a lot of money. They did that
12 so all of America could prosper, and they let the
13 cities and the rural communities work together and
14 partner together to let both sides benefit.
15 And, right now I think the rural towns
16 are struggling a lot more in the United States than
17 the -- than the larger towns, and I guess we don't
18 always have the population for all the voting, but I
19 think that America is going to be a lot better
20 society with the small rural areas doing well.
21 And I guess I just feel that right
22 now, a lot of the small communities, we feel like
23 we're climbing the rope out of the -- out of the
24 hole right now and starting to see the sunshine, and
25 I just -- taking the rail out of the area is going
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MAREK
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 to be just like cutting that last thread that we're
2 hanging onto to make our way out.
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
4 for your statement.
5 Are there any questions? Mr. Howell.
6
7 CROSS-EXAMINATION
8
9 BY MR. HOWELL:
10 Q. Is it fair to characterize your
11 testimony that the abandonment would have an adverse
12 and significant consequence on rural and economic
13 development in Grangeville?
14 A. It definitely would. It's one of the
15 most important factors right now.
16 Q. Thank you.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Commissioners.
18 Thank you very much for your
19 testimony.
20 THE WITNESS: Yep.
21 (The witness left the stand.)
22 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Don
23 Johnston.
24
25
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING MAREK (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 DONALD JOHNSTON,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Could you state your name and spell
9 your last for the record, please?
10 A. Donald Johnston, J-O-H-N-S-T-O-N,
11 Box 304, Craigmont, Idaho.
12 Q. And do you represent any entity or
13 organization?
14 A. Well, I'm president of the Craigmont
15 Chamber of Commerce, and I believe it would have
16 an -- abandonment would have a real detrimental
17 effect to the businesses in Craigmont. I don't want
18 to discuss too much about the safety because I
19 believe that this has already been discussed.
20 One thing that I would like to bring
21 up is that in the last number of years, Camas
22 Prairie Railroad has had two movies filmed on
23 segments of that Railroad, and I believe that they
24 probably made an income off of that.
25 Also, they have a motor car
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING JOHNSTON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 association in the United States, and this last --
2 yesterday, they had 40 of those cars come from
3 Lewiston to Grangeville, and they stopped in a
4 business here in Craigmont and spent an hour and a
5 half yesterday, and they spent $564 in this town.
6 And that may not sound like lot, but I can tell you
7 one thing, that business had a good day. And, my
8 understanding is that they charge -- or, the
9 Railroad charges them $100 per car, per day, to be
10 on the Railroad, and they are spending three days on
11 Camas Prairie RailNet.
12 I believe that there is other things
13 that we could look at besides shipping if it would
14 be pursued a little bit more by Camas Prairie
15 RailNet.
16 And that basically is my testimony.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you,
18 Mr. Johnston.
19 Are there questions for Mr. Johnston?
20
21 CROSS-EXAMINATION
22
23 BY MR. HEFFNER:
24 Q. Just one, sir: When were the movies
25 made, and what movies? I know that there were
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING JOHNSTON (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 movies.
2 A. The Wild Wild West was filmed here
3 just about two -- well, last year they were in here
4 or two years ago I guess they were in here, and they
5 filmed a lot from Reubens down over the grade. I
6 know there was only 30 seconds of it that was shown
7 in the actual movie, but they did spend I think
8 probably close to two weeks or more up here.
9 Q. Was it pre-April 17, 1998?
10 A. I believe it was -- I don't know if it
11 was before then or not. I thought it was late 1998,
12 but I'm not sure of that, because the movie just
13 came out here a year ago.
14 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
15 other questions? Any questions from the
16 Commission?
17 Thank you very much for your
18 testimony.
19 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
20 (The witness left the stand.)
21 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We'll call
22 Deloris Davisson.
23
24
25
125
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING JOHNSTON (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 DELORIS JUNGERT DAVISSON,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Would you state your name and spell
9 your last for the record, please?
10 A. Deloris Jungert Davisson,
11 D-A-V-I-S-S-O-N.
12 Q. And do you have an address?
13 A. 1567 Poplar, Clarkston, Washington.
14 Q. And are you representing any
15 organization or entity?
16 A. Not formally.
17 THE WITNESS: First of all, I want to
18 thank the members of the IPUC for holding this
19 public hearing, and I want to go on record as being
20 opposed to the Railroad abandonment on the grounds
21 that the Railroad asserts that prospects for any
22 future growth and development of traffic on the line
23 are poor. That might have been true, or perhaps
24 not. Idaho's past was predicated on industry-based
25 industries -- timber, mining, the agriculture
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING DAVISSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 industry -- and we know that this is the day of
2 change, so the future, as our last speaker just
3 said, might be based on other things. I have five
4 items that I want to share with you about the
5 possibility of future development for the tourist
6 industry.
7 He spoke about the 30 speeder cars --
8 40, maybe there were -- that came over the rails and
9 through the tunnels and trestles up Lapwai Canyon
10 and over Lawyers Canyon, and if each car holds four
11 people and each person spends about $200 a day in
12 our economy -- and last year I had dinner with the
13 folks, so this is a repeat performance, so we know
14 that their -- they liked what they saw. And last
15 year, they told me that they spent $600 to run their
16 car on the route. So if you do your multiplication
17 there, you find out that this is an underdeveloped
18 resource. Next month there will be another group of
19 speeders, bringing the income to the area and
20 extolling the riding and adding to the tourist
21 potential in our counties and to the state of
22 Idaho. So sort of like the Field of Dreams: If you
23 develop it, they will come.
24 Second, I want to share with you the
25 fact that there's a Lewis and Clark dinner train
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING DAVISSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 running out of Lewiston, carries about 100 people on
2 a run. They have run on holidays just starting this
3 year, $75 per head, and they have run to full
4 capacity everytime they've run. And I've heard --
5 I've been over there and people are clamoring for
6 rides to the Camas Prairie.
7 And foundations such as the
8 Albertson's Foundation believe in this train enough
9 to have recently given a substantial grant to
10 develop the use of the train as a traveling
11 classroom, and the Lewiston Schools are in
12 cooperation with this project. So, if you develop
13 it, they will come.
14 Third, the Department of Interior's
15 National Park Service Cultural Journal, Cultural
16 Resource Management, Vol. 22, No. 10, carried an
17 article this last year in December entitled On Track
18 Through A Beautiful Country. It describes the Camas
19 Prairie Railroad and its potential for cultural and
20 ecotourism. And I might say these are -- they're
21 not all poor jobs. These tracks traverse the
22 Nez Perce Indian Reservation and run through the
23 Nez Perce National Park -- National Historic Park.
24 And the article lists up the Camas Prairie Railroad
25 along with other railroads such as the Alaska
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING DAVISSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Railroad that runs to Denali, the Grand Canyon
2 Railroad, the Allegheny Portage Railroad, the
3 historic railroads in the National Park system and
4 beyond. So the Camas Prairie Railroad is in good
5 company.
6 Fourth, the Idaho State Historic
7 Preservation Officer writes the following in a
8 report countering the CPRN assertion that the rail
9 line and the 50 Railroad-owned structures have no
10 historical value. They state, and I quote:
11 Quote, we strongly disagree with this
12 statement -- this is a State Historic Preservation
13 Officer -- the Camas Prairie Railroad is clearly
14 eligible -- and they put "eligible" in italics --
15 for the National Register of Historic Places under
16 at least two criteria: Statewide significance under
17 Criteria A for its association with railroad history
18 in Idaho, and national significance under Criteria C
19 for its association with railroad engineering and
20 construction. The engineering aspects of the line
21 in particular, the gray trustles and tunnels, have
22 been noted by a nationally-recognized railroad
23 historian as being extremely rare surviving
24 properties, and the line in its entirety is an
25 historic engineering achievement that can be found
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING DAVISSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 nowhere else in the entire United States.
2 And they further say: It is our
3 professional opinion that the Camas Prairie Railroad
4 is potentially eligible for the National Historic
5 Landmark, and we also expect to be located along the
6 line archaeological properties associated with
7 Native American use of the area and railroad
8 construction. We are therefore recommending an
9 archaeological and historical survey of the 65.5
10 miles of the line to identify any such properties
11 and produce basic documentation of the rail line and
12 structures. The archaeological and historical
13 consultants should be well-versed in Railroad
14 history, as well as early Native American history of
15 the area.
16 They have forwarded that to the
17 Railroad after the Railroad said that it was of no
18 historical value.
19 Fifth, the National Railroad Fan (sic)
20 magazine, which is just going to hit the stands, in
21 their August 2000 addition has a two-page spread
22 extolling the use of the Camas Prairie Railroad for
23 its tourist potential and its fine dining. This is
24 already started. Idaho is a gateway to abundant
25 recreational, sporting, historical, natural
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING DAVISSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 resource, archaeological, and indigenous cultures;
2 and these tracks, tunnels, and trestles are unique.
3 The line in its entirety is an historic engineering
4 achievement that can be found nowhere else in the
5 United States.
6 I moved back to this area after being
7 gone for 40 years. I grew up on a grain and cattle
8 farm in the area, and farming was even declining
9 then, so I went off to do other things, having come
10 back here to retire. I rode on that line as a
11 child, and I rode on that line when I first started
12 to college, so that says something about how old I
13 am.
14 Anyway, that line, when we live here,
15 we don't realize how gorgeous and what a treasure we
16 have, and I hope the people in Washington who are
17 making the Decision will come out here and maybe
18 ride that train and see what they have to rule on.
19 In conclusion, the Camas Prairie
20 RailNet should not be allowed to abandon its tracks,
21 tunnels, and trestles. I don't think they've done
22 very aggressive marketing or have they exhibited a
23 serious focus on customer needs when we consider the
24 health of our rural communities and the change from
25 the resource-based economy. And their assertion
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING DAVISSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 that prospects for any future growth and development
2 of traffic on the line being poor are just plain
3 wrong and shortsighted.
4 So I would like to be -- I would like
5 to say that I oppose the abandonment of the Camas
6 Prairie RailNet tracks.
7 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
8 questions from Mr. Millward?
9 Mr. Howell? No?
10 From the Commission?
11 COMMISSIONER SMITH: No, thank you.
12 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
13 very much for your testimony.
14 (The witness left the stand.)
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Jamie
16 Edmondson.
17
18 JAMIE EDMONDSON,
19 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
20 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
21
22 EXAMINATION
23
24 BY MR. HOWELL:
25 Q. Would you state your name and spell
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING EDMONDSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 your last for the record, please?
2 A. Jamie Edmondson, E-D-M-O-N-D-S-O-N.
3 Q. And do you have an address for us?
4 A. Post Office Box 360, Elk City, Idaho.
5 Q. And do you represent any entity or
6 organization?
7 A. Yes. I'm speaking for the Idaho
8 County Historical Preservation Commission.
9 Q. Great.
10 THE WITNESS: And I'd like to thank
11 you for this opportunity to speak. A lot has been
12 said and the previous speaker talked about the
13 historical and tourism value of this.
14 The Commission would like to go on
15 record opposing the abandonment because of the
16 historical value of this line. We know that in 2003
17 to 2006, there's been an estimate of 4 to 19 million
18 people coming through here on the Lewis and Clark
19 Expedition, people following the trail. That will
20 greatly impact this area, and not only the increased
21 travel on the road will cause a danger, but also,
22 this affords the opportunity of a wonderful
23 development of historic travel on the line.
24 So I would just like to thank you
25 again, and we do oppose abandonment.
133
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING EDMONDSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
2 questions from the Commission?
3
4 EXAMINATION
5
6 BY COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:
7 Q. I just have one question: You said
8 your affiliation is with the Idaho Historical
9 Preservation Society. Is that correct?
10 A. Idaho County Historical Preservation
11 Commission.
12 Q. Idaho County. Okay. Are you aware of
13 any granting agencies that would provide funds for
14 some of the products and ventures that may have been
15 outlined in either your testimony or previous
16 testimony?
17 A. I'm not aware of any. There is a
18 foundation called Steele-Reese Foundation.
19 Q. Out of Salmon, Idaho?
20 A. No, they're not out of Salmon.
21 They're back East. They grant moneys to Idaho and
22 Kentucky, and they're mainly interested in education
23 and health care, but education can take the form of
24 the rail line and a traveling classroom, things like
25 that.
134
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING EDMONDSON (Com)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 I have not researched any grant.
2 Although I do write grants, I have not researched
3 any others, but that's the first one that comes to
4 mind, so there might be that possibility.
5 Q. Thank you.
6 (The witness left the stand.)
7 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Scott
8 Turlington.
9
10 SCOTT TURLINGTON,
11 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
12 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
13
14 EXAMINATION
15
16 BY MR. HOWELL:
17 Q. Could you state your name and spell
18 your last for the record, sir?
19 A. Yes. Scott Turlington,
20 T-U-R-L-I-N-G-T-O-N.
21 Q. And do you have an address for us?
22 A. I do. 846 Main Street, Lewiston,
23 Idaho.
24 Q. And who do you represent?
25 A. I'm here representing US Senator
135
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING TURLINGTON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Larry Craig tonight.
2 Q. Please give us your statement.
3 A. Thank you.
4 THE WITNESS: Mr. Chairman,
5 Commissioners, first, I would like to thank you for
6 the opportunity to allow us to offer some comments
7 this evening. Senator Craig is pleased that the PUC
8 is involved with this process, and we are hopeful
9 that this public hearing, as well as the PUC
10 technical hearing earlier this day, will warrant
11 further inquiry into this proposed abandonment
12 process.
13 Having said that, we would like to --
14 excuse me -- we would like the PUC to know of
15 economic importance this line has to the communities
16 it serves. Not only does it allow the shippers to
17 utilize low-cost transportation, but it also affords
18 them the ability to compete internationally.
19 I don't think it's necessary for me at
20 this time to get into the nuts and bolts of the
21 details. We are confident that the communities, the
22 public at large, and others, have and will
23 sufficiently provide the necessary factual details
24 and assessments needed to determine a viable
25 solution.
136
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING TURLINGTON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Again, thank you, Mr. Chairman and
2 Commission, for this opportunity to come forward,
3 and we look forward to your Decision.
4 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
5 questions?
6 One from -- sir.
7 MR. HEFFNER: Not really a question.
8 I basically just want to thank you and your boss for
9 your interest in this matter, and I'd be delighted
10 to meet with the staff in Washington in his office,
11 as I said to the other Representatives, to try to
12 find a solution: Federal funding, State funding --
13 THE WITNESS: Sure.
14 MR. HEFFNER: -- cooperative
15 discussions, whatever way I can.
16 THE WITNESS: I know we would
17 certainly encourage that and welcome that. It is
18 unfortunate, however, that your client has waited
19 until this point to seek that. Our doors are always
20 open, and will continue to be open.
21 MR. HEFFNER: We appreciate that.
22 THE WITNESS: We look forward to
23 that. Thank you.
24 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Commissioner
25 Smith.
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1 COMMISSIONER SMITH: Yes. I just want
2 to express our thanks to Senator Craig and also
3 Senator Crapo for their help in trying to get the
4 Surface Transportation Board to come to Idaho --
5 THE WITNESS: Yes.
6 COMMISSIONER SMITH: -- and listen to
7 the people and see the line. Although we weren't
8 successful in that, we really do appreciate their
9 efforts.
10 THE WITNESS: Well it was described in
11 that, as Mr. Miller mentioned earlier, the
12 delegation, for the public's information, did send
13 out a letter in April and also we sent out a second
14 letter requesting that, but of course that fell upon
15 deaf ears. That is unfortunate. So, thank you.
16 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Appreciate
17 your testimony. Thank you.
18 (The witness left the stand.)
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Doug
20 Scoville.
21
22
23
24
25
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1 DOUG SCOVILLE,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Sir, could you please state your name
9 and spell your last for the record?
10 A. My name is Doug Scoville,
11 S-C-O-V-I-L-L-E.
12 Q. And do you have an address for us?
13 A. 1240 Scoville Road, Potlatch, Idaho.
14 Q. Sounds like a good road.
15 Do you represent any entity or
16 organization in Idaho?
17 A. Yes, sir. I'm chairman of the Idaho
18 Barley Commission.
19 Q. And could you give us your statement,
20 sir?
21 A. Okay.
22 THE WITNESS: On behalf of the Idaho
23 Barley Commission and more than 670 barley producers
24 in Lewis, Nez Perce, and Idaho counties, I want to
25 express our appreciation to the Idaho Public
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1 Utilities Commission for convening this hearing on
2 the Camas Prairie RailNet Application to abandon the
3 Spalding to Grangeville branch line.
4 The proposed abandonment of the
5 Grangeville line would cause economic harm to more
6 than 670 producers in these three counties who rely
7 on rail service to more -- to the movement of their
8 barley to the market. More than 57,000 acres of
9 barley are planted in these three counties,
10 generating more than 74,000 tons, or 3.1 million
11 bushels per year. Production in Lewis and Idaho
12 counties, which are directly served by this branch
13 line, totals more than 56,000 tons, or 2.3 million
14 bushels. Currently, all of the malt barley produced
15 in these two counties -- approximately 40,000 tons
16 or 1.67 million bushels -- are transported on this
17 line.
18 The increase in direct transportation
19 costs that will result from shifting these movements
20 from rail to truck at origin will be about four to
21 $5 per ton, or five percent of the producers'
22 current selling price. Other increased costs will
23 include an additional elevation and handler's fee.
24 In total, these costs will threaten the future
25 profitability of the malting barley production on
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1 the Camas Prairie, which has been a desirable
2 location for malting barley due to quality
3 production and favorable logistics.
4 If alllowed to proceed, this branch
5 line abandonment may force barley contractors to
6 look elsewhere for their malting barley production,
7 particularly those areas located closer to the main
8 line service, and will leave the producers on the
9 Camas Prairie with one less production option in an
10 already economically-stressed economy.
11 We also are concerned about the impact
12 on the local and state highways as a result in the
13 increased truck movement of grain and forest trucks
14 from the Camas Prairie.
15 We urge the Idaho Public Utilities
16 Commission and the Surface Transportation Board to
17 work with the Camas Prairie RailNet to find an
18 alternative to abandonment, which could include
19 selling this line to a local shippers association
20 for a nominal fee after the line is brought up to
21 Class 3 operating standards.
22 In closing, let me emphasize that rail
23 service for the Camas Prairie is an integral part of
24 a multi-million-dollar malting barley industry in
25 this part of Idaho. A loss in rail service will
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1 strike a serious blow to grain producers who are
2 already reeling from 20-year-low prices and higher
3 production costs.
4 Again, we thank you for your time and
5 serious consideration in protecting cost-efficient
6 rail service on the Spalding to Grangeville branch
7 line.
8 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
9 for your question -- or, your statement.
10 Are there questions?
11
12 CROSS-EXAMINATION
13
14 BY MR. HEFFNER:
15 Q. One short question, Mr. Scoville:
16 Can you identify some shippers that
17 would be willing to buy the line for its net
18 liquidation value?
19 A. I wished I could, but not being
20 involved in that part of the industry, I am unable
21 to do it.
22 I would like to add that having
23 returned from a week in Japan with the new SBS
24 system and the interest in buying grain from the
25 United States, that there is a movement that we are
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1 presently able to have 50-percent share -- or,
2 45-percent share -- excuse me. I don't want to give
3 the wrong impression -- of approximately 140 million
4 metric ton. The -- within two years, this is going
5 to increase to approximately 600 million metric ton,
6 and this would greatly give the opportunity for the
7 Camas Prairie to participate in this type of the
8 industry too if they were still here.
9 Q. Thank you.
10 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Millward.
11
12 CROSS-EXAMINATION
13
14 BY MR. MILLWARD:
15 Q. Mr. Scoville, how are you doing
16 tonight?
17 A. Very good. Thank you.
18 Q. You're with the Barley Commission, and
19 I missed the tonnage you said or the bushels of
20 malting barley you grew in this area in your county
21 you represent. What was that again?
22 A. Approximately, 400 -- or, 40,000 tons,
23 or 1.67 million bushels, are transported by the
24 line, and 50 -- 56,000 tons, or 2.3 million bushels.
25 Q. And isn't it true that the reason you
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1 ship by rail with this malting barley is it has to
2 sit for a couple of days while the producer of the
3 malting barley -- the buyer of the malting barley
4 has to see if it will germinate; and if it won't
5 germinate, then it's shipped for pig feed or
6 something like that? Isn't that correct?
7 A. Well, I don't know whether that has
8 anything to do with that or whether it's going to be
9 shipped for pig feed or not, but what the important
10 thing that you need to know is that rail is the only
11 method that they are able to accept barley into
12 their facilities. Trucks have been tried but they
13 are just -- they're not set up for that. And that's
14 both north and south in any of our system.
15 I can't speak to whether they're going
16 to buy it or whether they're not because of offgrade
17 and going for pig feed, but transportation, getting
18 it there, is probably the main point.
19 Q. Okay. If -- are you aware of the
20 Surface Transportation Board's new recommendation
21 for the trucks? Have you been reading anything
22 about that, dealing with their hours of service,
23 things like that?
24 A. I have read, but I'm probably not as
25 familiar as I should be. Are you willing to
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1 acquaint me?
2 Q. Well in that report, I think I read
3 that if those regulations were imposed, that
4 trucking rates could increase by close to 50
5 percent. Now, I think that would be very adverse to
6 the shipping of your barley with the people you
7 represent. I was just wondering if you've been
8 thinking of the added cost of trucks if this rail
9 line is abandoned, if those new regulations do come
10 into town?
11 A. Very definitely. So not only the
12 added costs for trucks, but probably more seriously,
13 the added maintenance for the highway system, which
14 is totally unacceptable to take it that distance and
15 probably even out of this community too.
16 Q. Thank you, Mr. Scoville.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
18 additional questions, Mr. Howell?
19 MR. HOWELL: Just one.
20
21 CROSS-EXAMINATION
22
23 BY MR. HOWELL:
24 Q. Chairman Scoville, you've mentioned
25 that the Commission would like to see the line
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1 brought up to FRA Class 3 I think you said. Do you
2 know why that is?
3 A. That was just -- that was a
4 recommendation that -- from some of the personnel
5 within our office. I can't speak to it because I'm
6 not familiar with all of the Class 3 things, but I
7 do believe that, if I'm not -- if I'm not correct,
8 one of the things in Class 3 is to -- is a miles per
9 hour limitation of which would still allow the grain
10 to move safely from this community right here, and
11 that is what we have within our area up north, and I
12 don't think I've had any train wrecks up there yet.
13 Q. Keep your fingers crossed.
14 No further questions.
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Other
16 questions from the Commission?
17 If not, thank you, Mr. Scoville.
18 THE WITNESS: Thank you very much.
19 (The witness left the stand.)
20 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Call
21 J. R. VanTassel.
22
23
24
25
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1 J. R. VanTASSEL,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Good evening, sir. Could you state
9 your name and spell your last for the record?
10 A. J. R. VanTassel, capital V-A-N-,
11 capital T-A-S-S-E-L.
12 Q. And do you have an address for us?
13 A. 1127 Seventeenth Avenue in Lewiston.
14 Q. And do you represent an entity or
15 organization tonight?
16 A. I do. I'm the Chairman of Nez Perce
17 Board of County Commissioners.
18 Q. Please give us your statement.
19 A. Thank you.
20 THE WITNESS: Mr. Chairman, Commission
21 members, I kind of want to express my support for
22 those who are in opposition for economic and other
23 reasons, but as a representative of Nez Perce
24 County, the one issue that I particularly like to
25 address, and that's public safety.
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1 We have in Nez Perce County something
2 of an attractive nuisance. We've got the Webb
3 Cutoff Road which travels into parts of US 95 just
4 south of Lapwai, travels west into the Tammany Creek
5 Valley, where there are four different opportunities
6 for truck traffic to go through residential areas.
7 And I think that this is something that's very
8 necessary to keep in mind. While our roads out in
9 the county are basically built to carry heavier
10 traffic, there's residentialization going on in that
11 part of the community just outside the city limits,
12 and once there's truck traffic would enter into the
13 city limits of Lewiston, it would enter
14 highly-congested traffic areas and streets that
15 aren't built to carry that kind of traffic. So I
16 think that this would be a very negative effect on
17 rural Nez Perce County and the city of Lewiston.
18 I guess having said that, that about
19 sums up my concerns at this point.
20 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you,
21 Mr. VanTassel.
22 Are there questions? From the
23 Commission?
24 Thank you very much for your
25 testimony.
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1 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
2 (The witness left the stand.)
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mike
4 Edmondson.
5
6 MICHAEL J. EDMONDSON,
7 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
8 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
9
10 EXAMINATION
11
12 BY MR. HOWELL:
13 Q. Could you state your name and spell
14 your last for the record, please?
15 A. It's Michael J. Edmondson,
16 E-D-M-O-N-D-S-O-N.
17 Q. And do you have an address?
18 A. Post Office Box 360, Elk City, Idaho.
19 Q. And do you represent any entity or
20 organization?
21 A. Not officially, but I'm president of
22 the Elk City Ambulance, and I'm here as an EMT.
23 Q. All right. Give us your statement,
24 sir.
25 A. First, thank you for allowing to take
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1 the testimony. I'm glad to see that there are some
2 people that are concerned as far as representatives
3 for us in rural areas.
4 Again, I live in Elk City. I've been
5 an EMT, along with my wife, for approximately three
6 years. Although this abandonment would not affect
7 us as far as being EMTs, I guess I want to express
8 maybe an EMT outlook on the potential abandonment.
9 It's mentioned that there will be 10- to 12,000
10 additional trucks that will be traveling on Highway
11 95 or other roads as a result of rail abandonment,
12 and I wanted to put a real face on those people that
13 are going to be responding to those accidents.
14 Elk City Ambulance is all volunteer
15 service, and a lot of the rural emergency medical
16 services in this area are also voluntary or
17 primarily voluntary. Those are the people that are
18 going to be responding to those accidents.
19 During the day when I'm wearing a
20 radio and I'm listening to calls, a lot them come in
21 from the Kooskia, Kamiah, Lowell area, which is
22 Highway 12, and it's amazing the number of them that
23 involve truck accidents. And I guess we've been
24 quite fortunate in the three years that I have been
25 an EMT that I've not had to respond to one of those
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1 type of accidents, but believe me, that is the major
2 nightmare that I have is to come upon a truck wreck
3 that involves a family. And a million-dollar issue
4 as far as loss per year that was mentioned, I guess
5 if it was my child that was killed as a result of
6 this, I would somehow come up with the million bucks
7 if I could get my child back. And there is -- as
8 much as there is an economic impact on this, there
9 is potentially a real-life-people impact also.
10 I did happen to hear on the radio last
11 week -- and I'm glad to see somebody else had
12 mentioned it -- the possible changes that are in the
13 trucking industry that are being proposed by the
14 present administration, and one of the reasons given
15 for that is because of truck safety, and one of the
16 proposed solutions that I had heard was to eliminate
17 trucking between midnight and six a.m. And I'm
18 going from a safety standpoint, you're putting those
19 additional trucks now, if that legislation or those
20 proposed changes were to occur, during times that
21 school buses and families and just lots more traffic
22 on the highway to potentially be impacted.
23 And I would like to make one more
24 statement that's we were in Mackay last week and
25 stopped at the historical museum there and talked
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1 with an older fellow that had been born and raised
2 in Mackay, and happened to run into him right where
3 the abandoned rail line rail bed is at. And I asked
4 him, you know, I notice when we were driving up here
5 a lot of the empty potato storage sheds that are
6 down there. I'm not a potato farmer, so I'm not --
7 but it was interesting, his story on the abandonment
8 is similar to the Senator that had reported that
9 this gentleman stated that a number of things that
10 he saw the Railroad did to contribute to the
11 abandonment of rail service there. And Mackay looks
12 like a ghost town, and I am concerned that's going
13 to happen to our area also.
14 That's my statement, and I would like
15 to be on record as opposing the rail abandonment.
16 Thank you.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you,
18 Mr. Edmondson.
19 Are there questions for
20 Mr. Edmondson? From the Commission?
21 Thank you very much for your
22 testimony.
23 (The witness left the stand.)
24 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We'd like to
25 call now Dodd Snodgrass.
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1 DODD SNODGRASS,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Could you please state your name and
9 spell your last for the record, please?
10 A. Dodd Snodgrass, S-N-O-D-G-R-A-S-S.
11 Q. Do you have an address for us?
12 A. Yeah. 1626 Sixth Avenue North,
13 Lewiston, Idaho.
14 Q. And what is the entity that you
15 represent?
16 A. Yes, I'm the Economic Development
17 Director for the Clearwater Economic Development
18 Association.
19 Q. And do you have a statement?
20 A. Yes, I do.
21 THE WITNESS: Thank you for the
22 opportunity to be here.
23 CEDA -- Clearwater Economic
24 Development Association -- is a private, nonprofit,
25 development corporation serving Nez Perce, Lewis,
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1 Idaho, and Clearwater counties. For the record, the
2 executive committee of CEDA approved a resolution
3 opposing abandonment, and that was submitted to the
4 IPUC, as well as the Surface Transportation Board,
5 so I want to ensure that that's included in the
6 record.
7 Finally, the position is abandonment
8 of the rail line will be detrimental to rural and
9 community development. I don't know by whose
10 definition the region is considered sparse and
11 remotely populated, compared maybe to a
12 metropolitan, urbanized area, but under Idaho
13 definition, Grangeville is an urbanized area last
14 time I checked.
15 The Camas Prairie is a vital part to
16 commodity production. Fifty-nine percent of Lewis
17 County, for example, is land uses in agriculture.
18 And I'm sure the Idaho County portion up here on the
19 Prairie is equal or greater share.
20 The population trend since 1990 has
21 been growing in this part of the state. Idaho
22 County is up 9.2 percent, according to the Census
23 Bureau, since 1990; Lewis County, up 12 percent.
24 There are many challenges in this part
25 of the state. Unemployment is high -- high compared
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1 to the state average -- which is necessitating more
2 business and income-generating activities. This
3 part of the region -- in fact, much of North Central
4 Idaho -- is designated distressed counties by the
5 US Economic Development Administration.
6 But I want to point out a fact. There
7 is a manufacturing base on the Camas Prairie.
8 Mr. Spradlin's testimony in the record I think
9 stated otherwise. Fifteen percent of Idaho County
10 economic base is in manufacturing employment,
11 12 percent Lewis County is manufacturing base, and
12 that's compared to 15 percent statewide. So, Idaho
13 County and state are on par in manufacturing. Those
14 are 1998 shares by Job Service.
15 Economic development is essentially a
16 foundation of working solid infrastructure.
17 Transportation can be a limitation if development --
18 to development if options are reduced. We need to
19 seek cooperative solutions to maintain the rail line
20 and achieve economic diversification. That's truly
21 the strategy we're seeking to achieve in North
22 Central Idaho.
23 Finally, to maintain access and
24 opportunity -- excuse me -- the loss of the rail,
25 the intended impact on US 95 and feeder roads due to
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1 increased truck traffic, fuel efficiency changes,
2 maintenance and operation increase, and safety
3 concerns, combined with a threat to barge
4 transportation due to potential for dam breaching on
5 the Lower Snake, creates a real precarious and
6 disstabilized transportation system, which equates
7 to lost economic potential.
8 I don't believe that case was strongly
9 made by RailNet. It's really a dynamic analysis of
10 the transportation infrastructure and the results
11 that will occur if the rail line is abandoned. So
12 I'd like to urge the State to intervene and oppose
13 abandonment for the Spalding-Grangeville line, and
14 we appreciate your attention on this situation.
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
16 questions for Mr. Snodgrass?
17
18 CROSS-EXAMINATION
19
20 BY MR. HEFFNER:
21 Q. Yeah, Mr. Snodgrass, I've represented
22 economic development agencies which have acquired
23 rail lines, and my question to you, sir, is whether
24 your organization or similar organizations along the
25 line would be interested in putting together a
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1 proposal to buy the line for its net liquidation
2 value?
3 A. Well, I think, as Mr. Turlington
4 stated earlier, we would have liked to have heard
5 that request some time ago. And I can't say that
6 we're in a position to own and operate a rail.
7 Q. At least maybe to own?
8 A. We're interested in the maintenance
9 and operation of the rail and some entity stepping
10 forward. We'd prefer RailNet to stay in that
11 situation.
12 Q. Well I'm not saying that we wouldn't
13 be interested in being the operator, but although
14 I'm not sure that it's really my prerogative, I
15 would merely convey the message back to my client.
16 But for example, I represented an authority in
17 Pennsylvania which today owns 200 miles of former
18 Conrail trackage.
19 And so my question is, would there be
20 serious interest in putting together an
21 organization, be it an economic development agency
22 or a shipper association or the State of Idaho, to
23 come forth and to make a proposal to buy the
24 Railroad from us at its NLV -- net liquidated value?
25 A. We're interested in cooperating with
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1 any entities to keep the rail open and operating.
2 Q. Thank you.
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
4
5 CROSS-EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Mr. Snodgrass, you briefly touched on
9 what's often been referred to informally as the
10 one-two punch of rail -- losing rail line and then
11 dam breaching.
12 Can you explain a little bit more
13 about if the rail line were abandoned and breaching
14 were to occur, what the impact would be on the
15 economic development?
16 A. While I'm not prepared to present any
17 numbers or analysis, a lot of -- a lot of analyses
18 have been conducted. Suffice it to say that rail
19 and roadway and barge work hand-in-hand to transport
20 goods. If, in fact, it does come to the point where
21 the dams are breached and the rail is gone, we're
22 seriously, seriously going to be hurt in terms of
23 transportation of goods out of the region, into the
24 region.
25 Q. Thank you.
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1 MR. HOWELL: No further questions.
2 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Millward.
3
4 CROSS-EXAMINATION
5
6 BY MR. MILLWARD:
7 Q. Mr. Snodgrass, Mr. Heffner asked you
8 some questions about if your group or if you knew of
9 any group that was interested in purchasing this
10 line from Spalding to Grangeville, and I think you
11 stated you didn't know of any group. Is that
12 correct?
13 A. I can't say they have come to us, no.
14 Q. Have you heard of or seen of any
15 Application for this line for sale by Camas Prairie?
16 A. Pardon me?
17 Q. Have you read anywhere that this line
18 is for sale, other than just abandoned?
19 A. Just what I've read in terms of the
20 Application filing.
21 Q. And that being that it's never been up
22 for sale, to your knowledge, just for abandonment?
23 A. No.
24 Q. Thank you.
25 MR. HEFFNER: If I can comment, I
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1 believe my client has stated that they would be
2 delighted to sit down and discuss with appropriate
3 persons the purchase or --
4 (Small child approached.)
5 MR. HEFFNER: Hello.
6 -- subsidy of the rail line, and I
7 will state that for a fact that we are interested in
8 sitting down with whoever wants to sit down with us.
9 We can't sell it for a nominal value because my
10 client has spent considerable money buying it, but
11 we would certainly like to discuss the sale of the
12 line with a responsible entity.
13 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: So noted.
14 Commissioner Smith.
15 COMMISSIONER SMITH: Yes.
16
17 EXAMINATION
18
19 BY COMMISSIONER SMITH:
20 Q. I guess, Mr. Snodgrass, if we're going
21 to go about finding these appropriate persons who
22 have been referred to to explore the option of
23 purchasing this rail line, would you imagine that
24 might take some time?
25 A. It sounds like a very complicated,
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1 detailed process. I'm sure it would.
2 Q. Do you think that would be aided if
3 the Railroad were to withdraw its Request for
4 abandonment so that we would have the time to find
5 these appropriate persons?
6 A. We certainly believe it would be in
7 the interest of the Rail and the communities to
8 withdraw that.
9 COMMISSIONER SMITH: Thank you.
10 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: If there are
11 no additional questions, thank you for your
12 testimony.
13 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
14 (The witness left the stand.)
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: At this
16 point, we'll take a ten-minute break.
17 (Recess.)
18 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: All right.
19 We'll go back on the record, and while we're back on
20 the record, would also like to welcome
21 Representative June Judd. Thank you for coming this
22 evening; it's good to see you.
23 And our next witness will be
24 Barbara Greene.
25 (Approached with small child.)
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING SNODGRASS (Com)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And I think
2 we only need to swear one of you in.
3
4 BARBARA GREENE,
5 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
6 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
7
8 EXAMINATION
9
10 BY MR. HOWELL:
11 Q. When you get settled, could you state
12 your full name and spell your last for the record,
13 please?
14 A. Barbara B. Greene, G-R-E-E-N-E.
15 Q. And could you give us an address?
16 A. P.O. Box 310 (sic), Lapwai.
17 Q. And do you represent any entity or
18 organization?
19 A. Yes. City of Lapwai.
20 Q. Thank you.
21 A. Okay.
22 THE WITNESS: The City of Lapwai has
23 submitted comments formally probably several months
24 ago, and the concern is safety and increased truck
25 traffic flow. What I would like to do this evening
162
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING GREENE
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 is describe the community more vividly to you.
2 The city limits are approximately a
3 mile to a mile and a half long. In the heart of the
4 city, approximately a quarter mile long, there are
5 ten to 12 exits that go into the city itself. Those
6 are for -- they're used by the school district,
7 commercial businesses, churches, and residential
8 homes.
9 Some of these residential homes are
10 not fenced in. There are children that cross the
11 main highway to the other side to a creek for
12 recreational purposes.
13 The school district has about seven or
14 eight buses that daily use this highway for their
15 routes.
16 There is a church right off that main
17 road that during large functions, especially
18 funerals, that these people park on that main
19 highway off to the side.
20 We have a commercial grocery store, a
21 cafe, and service station also located on this main
22 highway. There is a lot of local residents that
23 patronize this area.
24 It would be evident of increased
25 danger to residents and visitors to our community,
163
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING GREENE
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 because it is also the main headquarters for the
2 Nez Perce Tribe, and because of the Bicentennial,
3 that will increase the visitors to our community.
4 Thank you.
5 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
6 questions from Mr. Howell?
7 MR. HOWELL: No questions.
8 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And coming
9 from the back is Mr. Heffner.
10
11 CROSS-EXAMINATION
12
13 BY MR. HEFFNER:
14 Q. Yes, I have one question, ma'am:
15 Unfortunately, I was out searching for
16 a solution and I did not have an opportunity to hear
17 your name or who you represent or what your interest
18 is, so could you kindly repeat it?
19 A. Okay. Barbara Greene, City of Lapwai,
20 and main concern is safety and increased truck
21 traffic flow.
22 Q. Okay. And thank you.
23 MR. HEFFNER: And I thank you.
24 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Okay. Any
25 questions from the Commission? Thank you for your
164
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING GREENE (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 testimony.
2 (The witness left the stand.)
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: The first
4 name, is it Laurine Nightingale?
5 MS. LAURINE NIGHTINGALE: Yes.
6
7 LAURINE NIGHTINGALE,
8 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
9 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
10
11 EXAMINATION
12
13 BY MR. HOWELL:
14 Q. Ma'am, could you please state your
15 name and spell your last name for the record?
16 A. Yes. Laurine -- L-A-U-R-I-N-E --
17 Nightingale -- N-I-G-H-T-I-N-G-A-L-E.
18 Q. And do you have an address?
19 A. Route 2, Box 1M, Reubens, Idaho.
20 Q. And do you represent an entity or an
21 organization tonight?
22 A. Yes, I do. I represent the Lewis
23 County Commissioners. I am a member of that board.
24 Q. Please give us --
25 A. Pardon me.
165
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING NIGHTINGALE
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Q. I'm sorry. Please give us your
2 statement.
3 THE WITNESS: First of all, thank you,
4 gentlemen -- ladies and gentlemen, and for being
5 here in our beautiful prairie. I'm glad you had the
6 opportunity to come visit.
7 The Lewis County Commissioners have a
8 great deal of concern with the abandonment of the
9 Camas Prairie RailNet from Spalding to Grangeville.
10 We are adamantly opposed to the abandonment and the
11 removal of this RailNet. We have the same concerns
12 of those who have testified before as far as the
13 economics for the farming industry, the lumber
14 industry, the tax basis, and so forth; but we have
15 another question from another point of view:
16 We want to know what happened or has
17 happened in the last two years -- excuse me -- in
18 the last two years after this rail line was
19 purchased that makes this enterprise unprofitable.
20 Surely the finances were carefully studied before
21 the purchase of this RailNet. Or was it purchased
22 with the sole intent of abandonment, to tear it down
23 and dispose of it piece by piece?
24 Was there an economic study done to
25 determine the adverse effect of the region if this
166
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING NIGHTINGALE
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 rail is abandoned?
2 Are there other avenues being pursued
3 to determine additional use for this line other than
4 shipping?
5 Has the preservation of historical
6 sites been considered?
7 We feel that there can never be a
8 value placed on the beauty of this historical and
9 scenic line. The historical, archaeological,
10 architectural, and cultural heritage of the state is
11 among the most important environmental assets of
12 this state. The rapid social and economic
13 development of contemporary society threatens to
14 restore the remaining vestiges of this heritage.
15 Having lived in the region all of my
16 life, I have had the privilege of being involved in
17 the heavy use of this rail line when it was a vital
18 link between the Prairie and Lewiston. I lived in
19 the little town of Reubens just on the south of
20 Craigmont here, and Reubens was established because
21 of the rail line. In 1907, the rail line came to
22 the top of the grade. We have the only turnaround
23 for the train between Spalding and Grangeville.
24 When the train passed through this
25 town, it came twice a day. This is back in my early
167
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING NIGHTINGALE
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 years. It carried the mail, and it carried
2 passengers, and it carried all the products. We
3 also had the freight train that came through, and I
4 don't remember if that came daily or not, but I
5 remember the carloads of lumber and grain that
6 passed through that little town on its way back to
7 the valley.
8 I've also had the privilege of
9 traveling this route when the train was our only
10 source of transportation to the valley or across the
11 Prairie. During the World War II, we didn't have a
12 car, so that was our only mode of transportation.
13 And unless you've witnessed this scenic route
14 personally, it is so difficult to imagine or put
15 into words the undescribable beauty or spectacular
16 view of the vastness of Camas Prairie or the canyon
17 that the train follows. The magnificence of the
18 tunnels, the bridges, the trestles remain to this
19 day for the enjoyment of our children and visitors
20 to our state.
21 What is now being proposed would deny
22 forever the vestiges and enthrallment gleaned from
23 experiencing the unique engineering landmark that is
24 truly the heritage of Idahoans. Could this not be
25 returned to not only a shipping line, but also a
168
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING NIGHTINGALE
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 recreational scenic tour?
2 Lewis County believes that in the
3 best -- that in the best public interest of this
4 area and state, a comprehensive program of historic
5 preservation be undertaken at all levels of
6 government -- of the government -- US government,
7 the State, and its political subdivisions -- to
8 promote the use and conservation of such property
9 for the education, inspiration, pleasure, and
10 enrichment of the citizens forever. Please do not
11 allow this to be abandoned and destroyed.
12 Thank you.
13 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
14 questions, Mr. Howell?
15 MR. HOWELL: No questions.
16 MR. HEFFNER: No questions.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Commissioner.
18 COMMISSIONER HANSEN: No questions.
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
20 for your testimony.
21 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
22 (The witness left the stand.)
23 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Steve
24 Riggers.
25
169
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING NIGHTINGALE
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 STEVE RIGGERS,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Sir, could you please state your name
9 and spell your last for the record?
10 A. My name is Steve Riggers. Last name
11 is spelled R-I-G-G-E-R-S. My address is Box 369,
12 Craigmont.
13 Q. And do you represent any entity or
14 organization tonight?
15 A. No, I don't.
16 Q. Please give us your statement.
17 THE WITNESS: I too am a farmer from
18 this area. I live here in Craigmont, and I'm
19 concerned about the economic impact that abandoning
20 the rail would have towards my brothers' and
21 myself's farming operation, but what I wanted to
22 talk about was another issues that's been addressed
23 somewhat today earlier by a gentleman from
24 Elk City. He did a very good job about talking
25 about the public safety issue.
170
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING RIGGERS
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 And I have been involved with the
2 Craigmont Quick Response Unit for the last four
3 years as a first responder, which is one step below
4 EMT, and we cover the area from approximately
5 Ferdinand, Idaho, down towards Culdesac on the
6 grade, along with the quick response units from
7 Winchester and Culdesac; and I can tell you in that
8 four years, I've been involved in some fatal
9 accidents on that stretch of road.
10 And that stretch of road is bad enough
11 without truck traffic on it because of the steepness
12 of the grade and the lack of pullouts, lack of
13 passing lanes. It's -- it can be extremely icy in
14 the winter. A lot of people come across the prairie
15 where the roads are free of ice and snow and then
16 enter the canyon, and it really is a bad mix for the
17 potential for those kinds of things to happen.
18 Our local quick response unit is
19 really threatened right now with burnout. We
20 have -- we're understaffed. A lot of times we have
21 only one person on call at certain times of the day.
22 Most of us are on call 12 hours, 365 days a year,
23 and it puts quite a burden on quite a few people.
24 One of the things I'm concerned about
25 is in the emergency medical field, they talk about
171
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING RIGGERS
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 the golden hour that you have when you're involved
2 in a trauma incident, and it's vitally critical to
3 get people to the -- to the hospital within an
4 hour. After that, chances of survival go down hill.
5 And we're not allowed to transport.
6 We have to have an ambulance service transport the
7 patients, and that's either going to come out of
8 Nezperce or Lewiston. And, you know, the prospects
9 of getting somebody from an accident on the grade to
10 Lewiston in less than an hour is almost -- it very
11 seldom can be done after extrication, all these
12 other things that have to take place.
13 We're not paramedics. There are a lot
14 of procedures that we can't do, and we have to wait
15 a lot of times for paramedics to arrive, and it's
16 not a good situation.
17 And there's no doubt in my mind that
18 if we abandon the rail and there's increased truck
19 traffic, there's going to be a dramatic increase in
20 the amount of serious accidents on that stretch of
21 highway.
22 So, in closing, I -- I -- I'm sure
23 that if the rail is abandoned, there will be more --
24 more accidents on that stretch of road. There's
25 going to be more fatalities. I think the chances
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING RIGGERS
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 are very good that people that live in this
2 community sooner or later will have a relative or a
3 close friend that is impacted by this.
4 That's all I have.
5 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you,
6 Mr. Riggers.
7 Are there questions for Mr. Riggers?
8 From the Commission?
9 Thank you for your testimony.
10 (The witness left the stand.)
11 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We'll call
12 now Lori Cox.
13
14 LORI COX,
15 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
16 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
17
18 EXAMINATION
19
20 BY MR. HOWELL:
21 Q. Could you state your name and spell
22 your last for the record, please?
23 A. My name is Lori Cox, C-O-X.
24 Q. And do you have a business address?
25 A. I do. Post Office Box 212,
173
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Grangeville, Idaho.
2 Q. And are you representing any entity or
3 organization tonight?
4 A. I'm actually only representing -- I'm
5 wearing three hats tonight: First of all, I'm
6 representing the Grangeville Chamber of Commerce;
7 second, I am representing the Grangeville Gem Team;
8 and, third, I will represent the Save the Railroad
9 Committee. Okay?
10 THE WITNESS: First of all, I just
11 gave the Commission copy -- or, pictures of what we
12 call speeder cars so that you understand what
13 we're -- what I'm going to tell you about.
14 I am the Executive Director of the
15 Grangeville Chamber of Commerce. I have held my
16 current position for the past 20 months. I've been
17 employed in public relations capacities for
18 18 years.
19 Grangeville is a community located on
20 the rail line proposed to be abandoned by Camas
21 Prairie RailNet. The existence of the rail line
22 serving Grangeville enables a number of
23 tourist-related activities that benefit the
24 communities along the rail line, Camas Prairie
25 RailNet, and the rural economy of the area. One of
174
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 such activities involves speeder car tours. A
2 speeder car is a motorized railroad maintenance car
3 designed to operate over Railroad lines. There is
4 approximately 300 speeder car clubs in the United
5 States. The speeder cars are transported on highway
6 trailers to various rail lines throughout the
7 United States and Canada. The speeder cars then
8 operate over the rail lines for an average of four
9 or five days.
10 I was instrumental in arranging for
11 two speeder car tours over the Camas Prairie rail
12 lines in 1999: One in May, the other in September.
13 Those speeder car trips began in Lewiston and
14 operated on the Grangeville line and on other Camas
15 Prairie lines. As these folks reached Grangeville,
16 I prepared the itineraries for their trip. A good
17 deal of time involved in those trips was spent on
18 the Grangeville line because that line is so scenic.
19 In fact, the scenic nature of the Grangeville line
20 is a major attraction for speeder car clubs. Due to
21 the beautiful scenic nature of the Grangeville line,
22 it is more responsible for the speeder cars'
23 presence than that of the other Camas Prairie lines.
24 There are two speeder car trips
25 scheduled on the Camas Prairie lines this year.
175
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 This first one is occuring as I speak, which
2 involves 40 cars for five days on the Camas Prairie.
3 The second trip is planned in July.
4 Speeder car trips will be likely to
5 continue and increase in number in the future,
6 because speeder car clubs are strongly drawn to the
7 scenic surroundings of the Camas Prairie rail line,
8 and especially the Grangeville line.
9 Based on our experience in 1999, each
10 person involved in speeder car trips spends on
11 average of $247 per day in our region. They average
12 two persons per speeder car. That translates to an
13 average revenue of $96,600 for the local area each
14 time there's a speeder car tour over Camas Prairie
15 rail lines. With three speeder car tours per year,
16 that means pumping over $285,600 per year of new
17 revenue into the local economy. That is extremely
18 beneficial to rural and community development in the
19 local area, especially bearing in mind that
20 unemployment is 10.2 percent in Idaho County and
21 7.3 in Lewis County. It would be harmful to rural
22 and community development if abandonment of the
23 Grangeville line was to cut off this important new
24 source of revenue.
25 Other significant sources of revenue
176
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 and tourism are the dinner train and motion picture
2 production on the Camas Prairie rail lines. The
3 dinner train is a huge source of revenue, in that
4 every day in the visitor's center we have people
5 requesting information on the dinner trains.
6 Between the Cottonwood, Craigmont, and Grangeville
7 Chambers of Commerce, we could fill the dinner
8 excursion trains exclusively with people from our
9 region weekly if such a service were to be
10 instituted.
11 Millions of visitors will be in the
12 area during the Lewis and Clark bicentennial
13 celebration between the years 2001 and 2006. We can
14 certainly capitalize on this market if given the
15 opportunity.
16 Lost a page here. Excuse me.
17 Another significant source of revenue
18 for Camas Prairie Railroad and the local economy is
19 motion picture production on the Grangeville line.
20 In 1999, a number of scenes from the motion picture
21 Wild Wild West were filmed on the scenic Grangeville
22 line. I have been advised that the producers of
23 that motion picture paid Camas Prairie rail line
24 approximately $185,000 as compensation for use of
25 the facilities on the Grangeville line during the
177
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 three weeks or so that filming was taking place.
2 The Idaho Film Bureau advised me that this is
3 likely -- that it is likely that the Grangeville
4 line will be used for filming railroad scenes in
5 western motion pictures on a recurring basis, unless
6 the line is abandoned.
7 The project manager for the railroad
8 scenes in Wild Wild West -- James Clark -- advised
9 the Bureau and myself that he was very pleased with
10 the scenic nature of the Grangeville line as a site
11 for filming railroad-associated scenes for western
12 motion pictures. As a matter of fact, according to
13 Mr. Clark, when he -- when it comes to scenes
14 involving railroads, prairie settings, or forested
15 settings, the Camas Prairie rail line is number one.
16 The local economy benefits
17 significantly when a motion picture is filmed in the
18 area. It is estimated that Region 2 in Idaho
19 approximately received $1 million spent in the local
20 area during the filming of the railroad scenes in
21 Wild Wild West. The local economy is in dire need
22 of revenue infusions of this kind.
23 Increased use of the rail line for
24 tourism would enable Camas Prairie RailNet to
25 collect more revenue and be a bonanza for the local
178
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 economies of the communities served by the
2 Grangeville line. All the Chambers of Commerce are
3 asking for is the opportunity to fill this niche on
4 the Camas Prairie. We would like to go on record as
5 opposing the abandonment of the Camas Prairie
6 railroad line between Spalding and Grangeville.
7 Should I go on to the next hat I'm
8 wearing? Okay.
9 The next hat I'm wearing is that of
10 the Gem Team in Grangeville, which I am a member.
11 The Gem Team has been approached by a company in
12 Wisconsin about putting in a strawboard plant.
13 First of all, this is just in the planning stages.
14 Each plant will provide -- this plant will provide
15 jobs for between 35 and 50 people. The jobs can be
16 expected to pay at least $20,000 per person, per
17 year. A 28-million-square-foot plant will use
18 approximately 35,000 to 40,000 tons of straw per
19 year.
20 It is estimated that 35 percent of the
21 particleboard that is produced will be shipped by
22 rail. Twenty to 30 cars per year will be coming up
23 the line carrying glue or a binding agent. And it
24 has been told to us through several studies that we
25 have done that it's 30 percent cheaper bringing
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 the -- or, carrying the particleboard by rail versus
2 truck.
3 That's my second hat.
4 My third hat is the Save the Camas
5 Prairie Railroad Committee is requesting the Surface
6 Transportation Board to reject Camas Prairie
7 RailNet's abandonment of the Spalding-Grangeville
8 line, and we have circulated Petitions throughout
9 this region for people to sign and especially to
10 make comments relative to highway safety and
11 economic development, and I would like to submit
12 these to the Commission. And these -- right here is
13 511 signatures, but we have lots more out there and
14 we will get those to you later.
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
16 THE WITNESS: Thank you for the
17 opportunity.
18 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Appreciate
19 your testimony. If you'd wait a moment to see if
20 there's some questions --
21 Any questions from Mr. Millward?
22 MR. MILLWARD: Yes, Mr. Chairman.
23
24
25
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 CROSS-EXAMINATION
2
3 BY MR. MILLWARD:
4 Q. I just have one question for you,
5 Ms. Cox:
6 I think it was in 1988 I had the
7 opportunity of coming up here on a Idaho Legislative
8 Northern tour. We came upon a train, Union
9 Pacific's train. I think some of the past Senators
10 and Representatives that are here today were -- I
11 had the opportunity to accompany them on it.
12 But I hope that you do have the -- or,
13 are successful in keeping this line, because I am a
14 locomotive engineer on the Union Pacific Railroad in
15 my daily life and I've covered I think either by
16 high rail or train every foot of this state, and
17 there is not a beautiful line than what you have
18 here, and I wish you all the success.
19 A. Thank you.
20 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
21 MR. HOWELL: Just a couple,
22 Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
23
24
25
181
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 CROSS-EXAMINATION
2
3 BY MR. HOWELL:
4 Q. Ms. Cox, do you know how much the
5 speeders pay the Railroad for the right to be on the
6 tracks?
7 A. I was talking to Chris Faldo
8 (phonetic), who is the gentleman that's in charge of
9 this particular speeder car tour that is here in the
10 region right now, and on this particular tour, he
11 estimates it's going to be between 5,000 and $7,000
12 to Camas Prairie RailNet.
13 Q. Okay. On the -- your testimony on
14 your last hat talked about the straw production
15 plant. Do you know what the production -- average
16 production of such a plant would be as far as straw
17 particleboard?
18 A. Let's see. I think it's -- oh, I'm
19 not sure what the production will actually be. I
20 just know how much we'll be using.
21 Q. I guess what I'm getting at: If
22 they're going to use 20 to 30 rail cars of glue, I'm
23 wondering how much product they will be shipping out
24 on the line.
25 A. I don't have those numbers right
182
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 here. Sorry.
2 Q. Thank you. No further questions.
3
4 CROSS-EXAMINATION
5
6 BY MR. HEFFNER:
7 Q. Ms. Cox, I have one -- two questions:
8 One, when would this plant come
9 on-line?
10 A. Right now we're just in the planning
11 stage, and the folks that we're dealing with out of
12 Wisconsin are trying to get -- we are trying to get
13 financing because it works as a type of a co-op so
14 that when -- what they're wanting to do is that they
15 will actually finance the production of the
16 particleboard, you know, getting the particleboard
17 plant built; and then it is my belief that they
18 would pay the farmers 28 -- this is projection, of
19 course -- but $28 per ton for the straw, and $10 of
20 that would actually be cash and $18 in the first
21 three -- this is in the first three years -- $18 of
22 the $28 would be taken out, given to them in stock
23 for the company itself. Hopefully most of that
24 would be just to give them some incentive to use the
25 particleboard plant so that we would at least know
183
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 that there's going to be straw in years to come.
2 Q. Do you think the company would be in a
3 position to guarantee a certain amount of freight,
4 or is that kind of a premature question?
5 A. It might be a little bit premature,
6 but we did talk about that because I did explain to
7 this gentleman that we are in the middle of this
8 abandonment issue, and his belief is that we
9 definitely would -- he definitely would use the rail
10 line. And I really -- I'm not speaking for him by
11 any means, but just by the things that he has said
12 is it would be something that they are looking at.
13 Q. Thank you.
14 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Any
15 questions from the Commission?
16 Thank you for your testimony.
17 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
18 (The witness left the stand.)
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Bill Flory.
20
21
22
23
24
25
184
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COX (X)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 BILL FLORY,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Could you state your name and spell
9 your last for the record?
10 A. Bill Flory, F-L-O-R-Y.
11 Q. And can you give us an address,
12 Mr. Flory?
13 A. Route 2, Culdesac, Idaho.
14 Q. And are you representing anyone
15 tonight?
16 A. Yes, I am, the Idaho Grain Producers
17 Association.
18 Q. All right. Please give us your
19 statement.
20 THE WITNESS: Thank you, Mr. Chairman
21 and members of the PUC.
22 I am a local farmer, representing the
23 Idaho Grain Producers, and pleased to have Idaho's
24 regulatory agency -- the IPUC -- here to hear some
25 of the concerns and what I consider to be
185
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING FLORY
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 opportunities, so I'd like to do three things
2 tonight: First of all, issue a message to the
3 owners; two, talk about differences and similarities
4 of other abandonments I'm familiar with in a general
5 sense across the US; and, three, talk about economic
6 consequences past, present, and future. So we'll do
7 that in that order.
8 Counsel Heffner, as a businessman to
9 businessman, I'd like -- I'd appreciate if you'd
10 deliver to your employers the fact that they enjoy
11 the public trust as a monopoly, and thus have what I
12 consider to be the responsibility to examine all --
13 and underline "all" -- the alternatives before
14 removing the most economical way to move ag and
15 ag-related products in this region.
16 The second thing I'm extremely happy
17 about is that they're not making decisions on my
18 farm.
19 Now, to go to point two, differences
20 and similarities of other abandonments that I am, in
21 general, familiar with, I've seen other abandonments
22 with similarities in Montana, North Dakota, and
23 Kansas. All were based on, one, a cost of
24 operations increasing; B, declining production area
25 bases. That means CRP, less production of ground
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING FLORY
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 and less producing acres in their market area,
2 expanding pasture for cattle or grazing, and/or
3 declining timber availability.
4 I've also seen increasing maintenance
5 costs of track and property. And these certainly
6 apply to a number of abandonment cases in general,
7 but there is some distinct differences here that I
8 think have been highlighted that need to be
9 specifically delineated: First of all, historic
10 perspective, and the second one is the fact that
11 traffic is actually increasing on this line, not
12 decreasing. Those are distinct differences.
13 The Railroads I'm familiar with and
14 have seen and heard about have had little
15 abandonment cases, little or no historic scenic
16 value except to the cows or the cars that they may
17 pass by. This Railroad has both historic and scenic
18 value yet to be fully recognized or valued.
19 The case in point, dinner, gambling,
20 cruise-ship-connected tours -- when I say "cruise
21 ship," I talk about the people out in the area that
22 come up the -- up the Columbia from Portland and
23 dock here -- certainly would be a great option. The
24 region -- you talk about regional economic
25 development. There's really nothing better, as has
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1 been delineated by other people before me.
2 And the scooter cars tour returning
3 from last year that is completing its return trip
4 from Grangeville today: Ask any of them about the
5 tour and this canyon. It's absolutely fantastic.
6 And they'll tell you about it, gauged by their
7 return. This whole thing is a sales force
8 management dream come true and tremendous
9 opportunity.
10 Second of all, let's talk about the
11 other major difference between this and some other
12 abandonments, and that's increasing -- I underline
13 "increasing" -- traffic with efficiencies in
14 competition built in. In all of -- all of the
15 situations that I've seen where abandonment was
16 considered, this is the only one where traffic was
17 actually increasing and there was a willingness of
18 noncaptive -- and I underline "noncaptive" --
19 shippers to upgrade, modernize facilities, and
20 access the Railroad.
21 So this is really not a typical
22 abandonment, not that it makes any difference, but
23 in the -- in the whole scheme of things, it makes
24 quite difference.
25 Second part of this, I'd like to talk
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1 about the economic considerations. In 1993,
2 Lewiston Grain Growers spent $523,470 in a
3 commitment to a unit train-loading facility that
4 included the overhead trough and -- that goes over
5 the highway from the concrete elevator -- and the
6 spur lines and the setting the footings for those
7 spurs, and actually putting them in from the main
8 line was expensive. That is a local capital
9 commitment, and a turnaround from the 1988
10 management philosophy of Lewiston Grain Growers that
11 a replacement elevator that replaced a burnt one
12 needed to be on deeded ground, not on Railroad
13 ground, away from the tracks because of abandonment
14 was imminent, it was any day, 1988.
15 I was Board Chairman of Lewiston Grain
16 Growers then. Management hammered into us that
17 Railroad was going to abandon any moment and had
18 that elevator on deeded ground away from the
19 Railroad was in our best interest long-term. But
20 five years later, they spent $523,000 of local money
21 in a major commitment to the Railroad with no
22 strings attached. Certainly, the co-op and their
23 patrons could have foregone rebuilding and pocketed
24 the insurance proceeds of a little better than
25 $1.352 million, but they didn't. And they did this
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1 for the future of the industry and their owners.
2 So what that comes down to is $930,000
3 above the insurance proceeds were spent, were
4 committed. These are local funds. They didn't come
5 out of the Chicago or St. Louis. These were local
6 funds at that point in time in a commitment, a
7 majority of which that money above the insurance
8 proceeds was for a unit train-loading facility.
9 Now, there's been a lot of discussion
10 tonight about salvage value and net liquidation
11 value, and the same thing applies to these
12 commitments that have been made locally. There are
13 also a number of other commitments that have been
14 made by other entities not as large, and there's one
15 pending in Fenn right now waiting for upgrading a
16 elevator along the rail line to load rail cars, but
17 they're waiting to see what the future of this line
18 is. So, the salvage value, liquidation value,
19 applies here, and it applies in as dramatic, if not
20 more dramatic, form than it does to the Railroad.
21 Abandonment may seem to be the best
22 option for the Camas Prairie, but until all the
23 variables are examined and while the Railroad demand
24 potential is increasing, it's premature at best.
25 Thank you.
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P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
2 questions from Mr. Heffner?
3 MR. HEFFNER: Yes, sir.
4
5 CROSS-EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HEFFNER:
8 Q. You may have heard me ask a number of
9 other witnesses if their companies or organizations
10 would be willing to either to commit to traffic or
11 to purchase the line, and do you know if your
12 organization would be willing to work in that
13 direction?
14 A. Our organization probably would not,
15 per se, but I know the importance of this line to a
16 number of individuals as myself who produce, you
17 know, 1,000 to 2000 tons of malt barley a year and
18 it's critical to our operation to have access to
19 this. I know there's a number of us who have
20 expressed some initial thought of potentially, you
21 know, seeing the value and investing in this for our
22 own longevity and competitive advantage.
23 I would say that the Shippers Council
24 would be -- I know there's been some discussion. I
25 know the shippers would be approachable on this, and
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P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 I think that -- I think, as indicated earlier, that
2 time is coming for that discussion to happen.
3 Q. Well, I'm certainly happy to exchange
4 business cards or assist in any way.
5 A. Certainly. I think -- and as I look
6 across the front row here, I see about $750 an hour
7 being tagged on to this process, you know, and maybe
8 it's -- maybe it's more than that, maybe it's less
9 than that. I see 300 over here and I see 150 -- oh,
10 I see zero.
11 Anyway I look at limited resources --
12 that's subject to debate -- I look at limited
13 resources for the industry and for a fledgling,
14 struggling economy, and I think expeditious
15 solutions are needed.
16 Q. Thank you.
17 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
18 MR. HOWELL: No questions.
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Millward.
20 MR. MILLWARD: I've already been
21 insulted. No questions.
22 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Commissioner
23 Smith.
24 THE WITNESS: Going, going gone.
25
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P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 EXAMINATION
2
3 BY COMMISSIONER SMITH:
4 Q. Yes, Mr. Flory, I guess "expeditious"
5 is a key word here, because the Surface
6 Transportation Board procedure is on a tight time
7 line. And in your business, this is the busy time
8 of the year, isn't it?
9 A. Well, as marketing goes on year-round,
10 shipping of unit trains from the Prairie to Lewiston
11 in a very competitive rate goes on year-round even
12 though there's no harvest going on, but that is
13 coming soon. Also, malt barley shipping goes on
14 year-round, and for us, whether it's barge or
15 whether it's rail, dependable, reliable delivery of
16 products to market upon demand is essential to our
17 future.
18 Q. Well, given that this is, what,
19 June 19th, and the STB is going to decide this by
20 September 10th or thereabouts, do you think there's
21 time under -- to put together, have the negotiations
22 and discussions that are necessary that you were
23 discussing?
24 A. Certainly, I don't have an answer for
25 that, but I cannot imagine that if some serious
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING FLORY (Com)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 negotiations and some dialogue was occurring that
2 that couldn't be dialed into that time schedule.
3 Q. Okay. Would it help if the Railroad
4 withdrew its abandonment Application to give those
5 time to engage in those discussions?
6 A. I'm sure. And you asked that question
7 before, and I still agree that that would be an
8 advantage, but good-faith negotiations and the quick
9 time line around those would be essential, you
10 know. Whether it can actually be -- whether
11 abandonment could be forestalled or not, I don't
12 know.
13 Q. Thank you.
14 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
15 very much for your testimony.
16 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
17 (The witness left the stand.)
18 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Thomas
19 Eier.
20
21
22
23
24
25
194
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING FLORY (Com)
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 THOMAS E. EIER,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Could you state your full name and
9 spell your last for the record, please?
10 A. Yes. I'm Thomas E. Eier, E-I-E-R, at
11 219 Twenty-first Avenue in Lewiston, Idaho.
12 Q. And do you represent any entity or
13 organization?
14 A. Yes, I do.
15 THE WITNESS: I thank you for
16 allowing -- I wrote this out waiting, so it's a
17 little better -- thank you for allowing me to
18 testify. I'm a member of the Clearwater Snake Lewis
19 Clark Centennial Committee. I'm the Vice Chairman
20 of the Clearwater Canoe Camp Club.
21 The Lewis Clark Bicentennial will
22 bring several million visitors to Region 2. To
23 date, tourism has not been addressed by the Camas
24 Prairie RailNet in their Application for
25 abandonment. Before abandonment is allowed, the
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING EIER
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1 Camas Prairie counties and towns should be allowed
2 to explore forming a 501C3 nonprofit corporation to
3 purchase the line. Forty speeder cars paid $60 each
4 to run their cars on the entire line this week.
5 That's $24,000 for 40 cars in four days. Today,
6 Monday, the Camas Prairie RailNet canceled a freight
7 train to Craigmont so the speeders could pass by
8 this very building. That is the impact of tourism
9 dollars that can have on supplementing the
10 maintenance of the Grangeville Camas Prairie line.
11 Our malt barley shippers making Budweiser cannot pay
12 all the maintenance costs. The tourism dollars can
13 be factored in to help support the shippers only if
14 we can come to the table with the RailNet owners.
15 There are three cruise ship lines
16 docking in Lewiston each week. There's over 600
17 tourists per week that can be identified to be
18 potential passengers on a tourist train. Before you
19 abandon the line, the tourists should have a chance
20 to save the line.
21 I ask that the IPUC oppose abandonment
22 of the Camas Prairie RailNet incorporated rail line
23 from Spalding to Grangeville.
24 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
25 for your testimony.
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P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Are there questions from the
2 Commission?
3 COMMISSIONER SMITH: Thank you.
4 THE WITNESS: Okay.
5 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
6 very much.
7 (The witness left the stand.)
8 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We'll call
9 Dennis Tanikuni.
10
11 DENNIS TANIKUNI,
12 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
13 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
14
15 THE WITNESS: Chairman Kjellander,
16 Commissioner Smith, Commissioner Hansen, ladies and
17 gentlemen, thank you for the opportunity to testify
18 before you this evening.
19 I'm Dennis Tanikuni, the Assistant
20 Director of Public Affairs of the Idaho Farm Bureau
21 Federation. We're comprised of 50,000 member
22 families, and are the largest general agriculture
23 organization in Idaho.
24 I've come to Craigmont tonight to
25 express the Farm Bureau's support of the efforts of
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING TANIKUNI
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1 the Save the Camas Prairie Railroad Committee,
2 elected officials, business concerns, other
3 organizations and individuals who are working to
4 keep the Camas Prairie RailNet operating on the
5 Camas Prairie.
6 The Camas Prairie RailNet is a vital
7 element of the North Central Idaho economy, moving
8 goods and raw products in and out of the Camas
9 Prairie. Abandonment of the Camas Prairie RailNet
10 may produce significant negative impact. Most of
11 those have been highlighted by previous speakers,
12 but I'd like you to consider some facts.
13 For instance, Lewis and Idaho counties
14 produce approximately eight million bushels of wheat
15 each year. Four million of those bushels --
16 50 percent -- are shipped by rail. A significant
17 amount of the four million bushels not shipped by
18 rail is produced near Nez Perce, Idaho, where no
19 rail service is available. It's our understanding
20 that wheat producers in that area are apparently
21 looking for ways to transport more of their product
22 by rail.
23 The significance of the malt barley
24 industry has been discussed at length this evening
25 by other witnesses. I think we have to keep in mind
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING TANIKUNI
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1 that 100 percent of the Lewis and Idaho counties'
2 malt barley that is sold for malting is transported
3 by rail, and that 80 percent of Lewis and Idaho
4 counties' barley production is malt barley.
5 The affect on the grain industry alone
6 will be extremely significant. The area's lumber
7 industry will be impacted, as will others. Growers,
8 shippers, and other commodity producers have worked
9 with the Camas Prairie RailNet to find ways to
10 increase outgoing rail shipments. It's the Farm
11 Bureau's sincere hope that these discussions
12 continue, even as the abandonment process
13 progresses.
14 We are intrigued that after only two
15 years of ownership in an environment of increasing
16 real and potential shipments, Camas RailNet has
17 declared the line unprofitable and applied for
18 abandonment. During the first year of operation --
19 1998 -- Camas RailNet moved 2,100 cars off the Camas
20 Prairie. 2,145 cars were shipped in 1999. Because
21 of increased shipper awareness and cooperation, an
22 estimated 3,000 cars will be shipped in the year
23 2000. It is for this reason that the Farm Bureau
24 encourages the Idaho Public Utilities Commission to
25 deny abandonment of the Camas Prairie RailNet.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING TANIKUNI
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1 We think that there are collateral
2 issues that must be discussed during this process.
3 Rights and responsibilities of all parties must be
4 determined and publicized. Landowners adjacent to
5 the rail corridor must determine the nature of their
6 property rights and how they will be treated if the
7 Camas Prairie RailNet is abandoned. Landowners with
8 reversionary property rights must be notified and
9 adequately compensated.
10 In closing, the Farm Bureau requests
11 denial of the Camas Prairie RailNet's abandonment
12 Application. It encourages the Save the Camas
13 Prairie Railroad Committee, the Camas Prairie
14 RailNet, and others, to find a means to maintain and
15 retain this vital transportation link. The Idaho
16 Farm Bureau supports these efforts and will be happy
17 to assist in a mutually-satisfactory solution to
18 this issue.
19 Thank you again for the opportunity to
20 appear before you this evening, and for conducting
21 this proceeding in the affected area.
22 Thank you very much.
23 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
24 questions? Let's begin with Mr. Millward.
25 MR. MILLWARD: No.
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1 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Howell.
2 MR. HOWELL: No questions. Thank you.
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And
4 Mr. Heffner.
5 MR. HEFFNER: Just, sir, how do you
6 spell your last name?
7 THE WITNESS: T-, as in Tom,
8 A-N-I-K-U-N-I.
9 I'm well-practiced at that.
10 MR. HEFFNER: Thank you.
11 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
12 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Questions
13 from the Commission?
14 COMMISSIONER SMITH: No, thank you.
15 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We've none.
16 Thank you for your testimony.
17 (The witness left the stand.)
18 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Shelley
19 Kuther.
20
21
22
23
24
25
201
HEDRICK COURT REPORTING TANIKUNI
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 SHELLEY KUTHER,
2 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
3 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
4
5 EXAMINATION
6
7 BY MR. HOWELL:
8 Q. Would you please state your full name
9 and spell your last for the record, please?
10 A. My name is Shelley Kuther,
11 K-U-T-H-E-R.
12 Q. And do you have an address for us?
13 A. Box 96, Craigmont, Idaho.
14 Q. And do you represent an entity or
15 organization?
16 A. I am with the Craigmont unit of the
17 Lewis County Historical Society.
18 Q. Please give us your statement.
19 THE WITNESS: The Craigmont unit of
20 the Lewis County Historical Society believes that
21 there are other values at stake in addition to the
22 financial ones in abandoning the Lewis -- the Camas
23 Prairie Railroad. The abandonment will have a
24 negative historical impact on this area.
25 The building of the line, and
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING KUTHER
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1 especially of Lawyers Canyon trestle, was quite a
2 feat of engineering for that time. It was built as
3 the highest steel bridge in the United States, and
4 the second highest bridge in the world.
5 According to the 1982 Idaho bridge
6 inventory by Rebecca Herbst (phonetic) and position
7 of the Idaho State Society -- and I quote -- The
8 construction of this line was one of the most
9 impressive engineering achievements of its time.
10 The Railroad is particularly notable for the number
11 of original bridges remaining intact along the
12 length of its line. The Lawyers Canyon viaduct is
13 the most outstanding among these, and represents a
14 significant accomplishment in the history of bridge
15 engineering. End quote.
16 The builders of Lawyers Canyon
17 bridge -- the American Bridge Company -- had to
18 depart from the established standard used to build
19 this type of structure, and a specifically designed
20 derrick car was used to put the steel in place. The
21 derrick car moved over each tower as it was
22 completed to begin construction of the next tower.
23 The spans between the six highest towers exceeded
24 the length of the boom on the derrick car, so a
25 special technique was developed to construct those
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1 towers. It is unknown if this technique was ever
2 used anyplace else. There were other trestles built
3 on this line, but none of them presented the same
4 kind of engineering challenge as the Lawyers Canyon
5 bridge.
6 Large numbers of workers were needed
7 to complete the Railroad. Italians were one of the
8 nationalities who worked to build this line. In the
9 Reubens area, it is reported that dago ovens may
10 still be found. These are hollow, round,
11 beehive-shaped structures built out of stones in
12 which the Italians are said to have cooked.
13 According to the memories of one
14 old-timer, the Italians were the cleanup labor on
15 the Lawyers Canyon bridge and they lived in dugouts
16 on the canyon floor. Perhaps if one knew where to
17 look for these, they might still be found. Maybe
18 these are the archaeological properties that were
19 mentioned earlier this evening.
20 In 1908, Lillian Bell began taking
21 pictures of the line from Culdesac to Grangeville.
22 She rode her horse to a vantage point often high
23 above the tracks to take her photos. Some of these
24 were then sent to Germany to be colorized, which was
25 a fairly new process at that time.
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1 These are samples of Lillian Bell's
2 photos.
3 "Aunt Lil," as her family called her,
4 may have been one of the first women in the
5 United States to capture the beginning of a
6 railroad, and certainly she was the first in this
7 area.
8 Mailing May is a children's book about
9 a five-year-old girl who was mailed from Grangeville
10 to Lewiston in 1914. Apparently, Mary --
11 May Pierstorff was the only human being ever to be
12 mailed, and this event has gained national
13 attention. Articles about it have appeared in a
14 national stamp magazine and in the L. M. Boyd trivia
15 column which appears next to the funnies in many
16 papers.
17 The engineer of the first train to
18 cross Lawyers Canyon bridge on December 9, 1908, was
19 recorded by the Idaho County Free Press to have
20 received extra pay in the amount of 1,000 to $2,000,
21 a princely sum for those days. Evidently, they
22 thought the bridge would not hold up or the train
23 would fall off. The passengers on that train
24 received a metal commemorating that event.
25 Evidently, when the Railroad went
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1 through Ilo and Vollmer, which is now Craigmont,
2 work started on the line between the two towns and
3 Nez Perce. Apparently, this line was finished by
4 the summer of 1910, as a ribbon commemorating the
5 opening of the Nez Perce Railroad has been found
6 sewn into a quilt that is approximately ninety years
7 old. It makes up one of the quilt blocks.
8 Evidently, when the first train came
9 from Grangeville and when the first train came from
10 Nez Perce, those people felt that this was something
11 historic that needed to be commemorated with some
12 sort of an item, either the medallion, or the
13 ribbon.
14 In 1989, the Craigmont unit of the
15 Lewis County Historical Society started paperwork to
16 put Lawyers Canyon bridge on the National Register
17 of Historic Places. At that time, we received a
18 letter from the Idaho State Historical Society,
19 stating that the bridge was, indeed, eligible;
20 however, it did not make it onto the National
21 Register. You heard testimony earlier about a
22 letter stating the criteria under which the bridge
23 was eligible.
24 The Historical Society feels that an
25 irreplaceable part of the history of this area would
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1 be lost if these tracks are abandoned and sold for
2 salvage.
3 That completes my testimony.
4 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Are there
5 questions? From the Commission?
6 COMMISSIONER SMITH: No.
7 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: I may need
8 that book in a few years: My kids are just learning
9 how to talk; we're looking for options.
10 Thank you very much for your
11 testimony.
12 THE WITNESS: Thank you very much.
13 (The witness left the stand.)
14 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mark Benson.
15 Did we lose Mark Benson?
16
17 MARK BENSON,
18 appearing as a public witness, being first duly
19 sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
20
21 EXAMINATION
22
23 BY MR. HOWELL:
24 Q. Good evening, sir. Could you please
25 state your name and spell your last for the record?
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING BENSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 A. Mark Benson, B-E-N-S-O-N.
2 Q. And do you have an address?
3 A. P.O. Box 1388, Lewiston, Idaho.
4 Q. And are you representing any entity or
5 organization?
6 A. I am representing Potlatch
7 Corporation.
8 Q. Please give us your statement.
9 THE WITNESS: Potlatch Corporation is
10 a diversified forest products company headquartered
11 in Spokane, Washington. We have significant
12 holdings in Northern Idaho, including a pulp and
13 paperboard and tissue manufacturing complex, two
14 plywood mills, two sawmills, a particleboard plant,
15 and approximately 670,000 acres of forest land. The
16 pulp, paperboard, and tissue manufacturing complex
17 located at Lewiston, plywood mill located at JP near
18 Pierce, and several hundred thousand acres of timber
19 land are serviced by the Camas Prairie RailNet.
20 Though Potlatch has no business
21 operations on the Spalding-Grangeville line, I
22 believe we are Camas Prairie's largest customer and
23 have a very direct interest in CSPR's large strategy
24 for rationalizing its railroad, especially for those
25 lines east of Lewiston.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING BENSON
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701 Public
1 Our plywood mill at JP and a log rail
2 transfer out at that same location are very
3 dependent upon CSPR operations. Our concern, and
4 frankly our fear, is that the Grangeville-Spalding
5 abandonment is simply the first in a series of
6 abandonment Applications, with the Kamiah and JP
7 branches perhaps next for consideration. If such is
8 the case, the eventual impact on affected
9 communities could devastating.
10 We have two primary concerns about the
11 Application being considered here:
12 First, the loss of rail service will
13 increase demand for truck service in the region and
14 will undoubtedly affect truck availability and rates
15 from our plants in JP and in Lewiston.
16 And, secondly, we're concerned, as I
17 said before, that the Grangeville Application is
18 simply the opening salad bowl for future abandonment
19 proceedings that will have a direct impact on
20 Potlatch operations.
21 Because of the relatively remote
22 location of plants from the Camas Prairie line, rail
23 service is often the only viable transportation
24 option available to reach distant markets. Loss of
25 rail service will cause those who have located their
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1 businesses along this rail line to lose
2 competitiveness with other shippers that do have
3 access to rail service.
4 We believe that the Idaho Public
5 Utility Commission should participate in the
6 proceeding before the Surface Transportation Board
7 to protect the interests of the affected shippers in
8 this region. Potlatch Corporation hereby requests
9 your participation in these proceedings.
10 Thank you.
11 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Mr. Millward.
12 Mr. Howell. And, Mr. Heffner. Commissioners?
13 Thank you for your testimony.
14 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
15 (The witness left the stand.)
16 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Gary Hanes.
17 MR. GARY HANES: Mr. Chairman, my
18 testimony was taken care of by Lori Cox. Thank you.
19 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you
20 again for attending.
21 Jim Babb.
22 A VOICE: I think Jim's was also taken
23 care of by Ms. Cox.
24 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Is Mr. Babb
25 here? No? Okay, he must have left.
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HEDRICK COURT REPORTING COLLOQUY
P.O. BOX 578, BOISE, ID 83701
1 And, Mick Kinzer.
2 A VOICE: He left.
3 COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: He left.
4 Okay. Thank you.
5 That exhausts our list. Is there
6 anyone else who would like to testify who has not
7 had an opportunity yet to sign up?
8 Well, at this point, I want to thank
9 everyone for participating tonight; and as a
10 Commission, we'll be taking your comments and any
11 written statements under consideration as we begin
12 our deliberation on this matter. I believe that
13 there is still a very short window of opportunity if
14 you want to submit additional written comments to
15 the Commission. I believe that the Commission needs
16 to make a Decision sometime in the very near future
17 to meet the STB requirements, so I wouldn't wait
18 much longer than a couple of days if you want to
19 submit additional written comments.
20 With that, this public hearing is
21 adjourned, and if the other parties would like to
22 remain, we'll continue with the technical hearing
23 that we started at 3:30 and hope that the building
24 lights stay on until we're finished.
25 So, we are adjourned.
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