20040928Vol IV Boise.pdf

.::'r " """"""""""
ORIGINAL
BEFORE THE IDAHO PUBLIC UTIL~MSf~~~iSSion
RECEIVED
) .
SEP Z 7 2004
Complainant,
, )
Boise. IdahoIDAHO POWER COMPANY
vs.CASE NO. IPC-04-
CITY OF EAGLE f IDAHO,
Re spondent .
BEFORE
COMMISSIONE~ PAUL KJELLANDER (Presiding)
COMMIS S IONER MARSHA H. SMI TH '
COMMISSIONER DENNIS HANSEN
c. -
PLACE:Commission Hearing Room
472 West Washington
Boise, Idaho
DATE:September 10" 2 0 04
VOLUME IV - Pages 518 -605
CSB-REpORTING
Constance S. Bucy,CSRNo. 187
17688 Allendale Road *WiYder, Idaho 83676
[phone] * [phone]
Email csb~spro.net
' - u.
, -.
For the Staff:Donald Howell, Esq.
Deputy At torney General
472 West Washington
Boise , Idaho 83720 - 0074
For Idaho Power:Monica B. Moen, Esq.
and Barton L. Kline, Esq.
Idaho Power Company
Post Office Box
Boise , Idaho 83707 - 0070
For City of Eagle:MOORE SMI TH BUXTON & TURCKE
by Bruce M. Smith, Esq.
and Susan E. Buxton, Esq.
255 North 9th Street
Suite 420
Boise, Idaho 83702
For Eagle River , LLC:HOLLAND & HART LLP
by B. Newal Squyres, Esq.
Post Office Box 2527Boise, Idaho 83701
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
AP PEARANCE S
83676
WITNESS EXAMINATION BY
Ms. Moen (Direct-Reb)
Prefiled Rebuttal Testimony
Ms. Moen (Direct-Reb Cont' d)Ms. Buxton (Cross-Reb)Mr. Squyres (Cross-Reb)Mr. Howell (Cross-Reb)Commissioner Kj ellander
Commissioner Hansen
Commissioner Smith
Commissioner Kj ellander
Commissioner Hansen
Ms. Moen (Redirect)
PAGE
519
521
547
560
577
580
583
585
588
591
593
594
David L. Sikes
(Idaho Power)
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho 83676 INDEX
Premarked
Admitted
Premarked
Admi t t ed
Admitted
Premarked
Admitted
Admitted
PAGE
604
604
604
604
604
NUMBER DESCRI PTION
FOR IDAHO POWER COMPANY:
6 - Exhibi t sponsored by David
L. Sikes
7 - Star Area Study, Outline
8 - Eagle Area Idaho Power Facilities
Map, 11-21- 02
9 - Excerpt from City of Eagle
Comprehensive Plan, 4.7 Other
Services & Utilities
FOR THE CITY OF EAGLE:
128 - 139
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho 83676 EXHIBITS
BOISE , IDAHO , FRIDAY , SEPTEMBER 10, 2004, 10:00 A.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Well , good
morning.We'll be back on the record to continue our
hearing and we all know who we are, so we won't run
through any appearances of the parties and it's good to
see everybody here all bright-eyed after last night and
want to thank all the parties in terms of their
appearances last night.I know it's a contentious issue
and I don't know that anybody would have figured that out
from any of the questions that were asked, so I want to
thank all of you for the way in which you conducted
yourselves last night.
Okay,think we'ready for one last
wi tness and recall,Ms.Moen you said that was
10-15 -minute process,we'ready for you to kick
off.
MS. MOEN:Thank you.Idaho Power calls
David Kip Sikes.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
518 COLLOQUY83676
DAVID L. SIKES,
produced as a rebuttal witness at the instance of Idaho
Power Company, having been previously duly sworn , resumed
the stand and was further examined and testified as
follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. MOEN:
Mr. Sikes , you've already been sworn in
and identified through the group, so I won't go through
that process, but have you previously filed written
rebuttal testimony consisting of 18 pages and Exhibits
to 9 on behal f of Idaho Power Company?
Yes have.
And do you wish
that written testimony?
to make any correct ions to
No.
And if I were to ask you the questions
that are contained in that written testimony today, would
your responses to those questions be the same?
Yes , they would.
MS. MOEN:Mr. Chairman , I move that the
prefiled testimony of David Sikes consisting of 18 pages
be spread on the read as if read in its entirety and that
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
519 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Powe r Company83676
Exhibits 6 to 9 be marked for identification.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Thank you.
Without objection , we'll do just that.
of Mr.David
(The following prefiled rebuttal testimony
L. Sikes is spread upon the record.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
520 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Powe r Company83676
Please state your name and identify the party
upon whose behalf you are presenting rebuttal testimony.
My name is David L. Sikes.I am al so known as
Kip Sikes. I am testifying on behalf of Idaho Power
Company.
Are you the same David L. Sikes that presented
direct testimony in this proceeding?
Yes.
What lssues will you address in your rebuttal
testimony?
In response to the testimony of Commission
Staff member Randy Lobb concerning the Idaho Public
Utilities Commission's need to determine whether the
facilities proposed by Idaho Power Company are needed, my
testimony will emphasize the urgency of needing to
construct the proposed 138-kV transmission line between
the Eagle and Star substations.I will also address the
viability of some of the various routes and alternatives
for the location of the proposed transmission line that
were discussed with the City and its representatives and
I will show that the City of Eagle has previously
endorsed two transmission corridors that are the subj ect
of this proceeding.Additionally, I will address other
issues identified by the other parties in their direct
testimony.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
521 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Commission Staff member Lobb notes in his
testimony on page 5 that none of the parties appear to
contest the need or benefits of the proposed 138-kV line
between the Eagle and the Star substations.Please
summarize the purpose of the proposed transmission line.
In the near-term , the line will provide a
source of electricity to the Star Substation.In the
long-range, excepting outages or other temporary
operating conditions which rely on the transmission or
distribution systems for alternate back-up supply, 100
percent of the power carried by the portion of this line
located within Eagle's jurisdictional boundaries will
serve Idaho Power Company customers who 1 i ve wi thin
ei ther the Ci ty of Eagle or the Ci ty' s Impact Area.
Is any new information available since you
filed your direct testimony in this matter that
emphasizes the urgency of needing to construct the
transmission line between the Eagle and Star substations
and the benefits to the Company's customers who would be
served by thi s ine?
Yes.Load information at the Star substation
for August 1 and 2 , 2004 is attached hereto as Exhibit
The summer of 2004 did not have the sustained high
temperatures experienced in 2003 however, there was a
brief period of high temperatures in late July and early
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
522 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
August of 2004.As shown on Exhibit 6, the load at the
Star substation on Sunday evening at 7: 26 PM was 8.64 MW.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
The
523 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
combined load for the Lansing and Star substations
(identified on the chart as LNSGSTAR.MW) was 22.35 MW at
the same time.On Monday August 2 , 2004 , their
respecti ve loads were 8.55 MW and 22.92 MW at 7: 06 PM.
Please explain why these loads are material.
The loads experienced on Sunday evening, August
, 2004 , are the maximum loads observed during the summer
of 2004 for the existing Star Substation.This load
response lS characteristic of residential-type loads, the
predominant type of growth in the area currently served
by the Star Substation.Normally, one does not expect to
establish a peak load on a Sunday evening when many
commercial establishments aren't using significant
amounts of electrical energy.
For example , the total area load served by the
Lansing and Star substations of 22.92 MW on Monday,
August 2 , was slightly higher , even though the
temperature was somewhat cooler. Analysis I have
performed in the past on Treasure Valley loads has shown
as much as a one percent load increase per degree
increase in the daily maximum temperature.Shoul d
experience several days of high temperatures and demand
saturation during the middle of a week , the loads could
be even ten percent higher.
Q. Can the Star and Lansing substations handle
loads of this magnitude?
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
524 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
No.Power flow studies on the 69-kV line
currently supplying the Lansing and Star substations
indicate the system is voltage-constrained at
approximately 23 MW , the demand which was reached on
Monday, August 2 , 2004.Wi th the cont inued growth and
development of Star and west Eagle, the 69-
configuration supplied from the Caldwell source is unable
to reliably serve the load above that level.It is
critical that this configuration be upgraded to assure
service reliability and to prevent the potential
occurrence of outages during the summer of 2005.
I have also included a copy of the Star Area Study.
It is identified as Exhibit 7 hereto.On page 4 of that
document is a table showing that the expected load on the
Star substation for the summer of 2004 is 8.17 MW. The
actual peak described above on Sunday, August 1, 2004
was 8.64 MW , or almost one half MW higher.This
demonstrates that the capaci ty of the system has been
reached.The emergency measures put in place by Idaho
Power for the summer of 2004 will not accommodate the
expected loads in 2005 as growth continues to accelerate
in the area.
If completion of the 138-kV line is delayed
beyond May 2005 for any reason , what means does Idaho
Power have available to ensure reliable service to its
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
525 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
customers?
Mobile diesel generators could be installed in
the area to reduce peak loading.However , as noted in
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
526 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
the testimony of Commission Staff member Randy Lobb
Idaho Power's experience with the placement of mobile
generators during the 2000/2001 energy crisis
demonstrated significant customer opposition and a high
cost of operation.Furthermore, this is a temporary
solution requiring additional environmental permitting.
Voluntary and involuntary load reductions could be
used; however , those types of reductions also incur
additional costs and usually result in customer
inconvenience. Al ternati vely, Idaho Power may have ' to
request that addi tional development in the impacted area
be delayed until construction of the line is allowed and
is complete.
Does Idaho Power continue to recommend the
alternative routes or solutions that it included in its
filed Complaint in this matter?
Yes , wi th the exception of the two routes
proposed along Highway 55 and either Floating Feather
Road or Beacon Light Road.Sufficient time no longer
exists to negotiate with property owners to acquire the
necessary rights-of-way to construct a facility along
those alignments.
With regard to the remaining four alternatives,
provided that cost recovery issues are appropriately
addressed , Idaho Power remains somewhat indifferent to
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
527 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Powe r Company83676
the ultimate solution.The Company's proposal that the
Eagle Bypass Route be selected is based upon input
received from the City of Eagle's Community Advisory
Committee ("CAC") , the Company's ability to construct the
transmission line in that location given the compressed
construction schedule and the nature and characteristics
of the work in that particular location.
Can the proposed 138-kV transmission line be
placed underground as requested by the City of Eagle?
Yes.Although the technologies exist to
construct 138-kV transmission lines underground , it is
not the industry standard to construct these types of
facilities in that configuration due to the cost and the
impact on consumer rates.Furthermore, at this late
date, it is uncertain whether a proj ect of that scope
which also requires special equipment can be completed in
a timely manner in this particular case , that is , by May
2005.
Even though the Company has no personal experience
placing transmission lines underground and although
burying transmission lines is not the industry standard,
the Company is not opposed to that kind of construction
provided the entity or jurisdiction either requesting or
demanding that type of construction pay the differential
in cost between overhead construction and placing those
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
528 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
ines underground.
It is the Company's position that that cost should
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
529 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
not be borne by Idaho Power customers generally since
that is not a construction standard practiced in either
the Company's service terri tory or in the industry as a
whole.Idaho Power's policy continues to be that the
requesting party of such premium service should bear the
incremental costs in constructing that serVlce.
Do viable al ternati ves exist to construct the
138-kV transmission line in Eagle in an overhead
configuration?
Yes , from the Company's perspective , viable
alternatives exist that do not distribute the additional
costs requested by the Ci ty to the Company's ratepayers
generally.In her testimony, Mayor Merrill claims that
Idaho Power failed to provide the City with viable
alternatives to the placement of transmission lines
through the City.However , as alleged in its Complaint
the Company presented six route options to the City.
addition , Idaho Power representatives discussed
alternatives with the CAC , the committee that was
composed of Eagle residents who ultimately recommended
the Eagle Bypass Route as the preferred route for the
proposed transmission line.
The bottom line is that the alternative alignments
for the proposed 138-kV transmission line in and of
themsel ves do not appear to be the real issue among theparties. It is the presence of those facilities in an
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
530 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
overhead configuration , as proposed by Idaho Power , that
is causing the deadlock that has resulted in this case.
Does the Ci ty' s Comprehensive Plan address the
provlslon of electrical services wi thin its
jurisdictional boundaries?
Yes, it does.The City's Comprehensive Plan
illustrates the use of both the State Street and Eagle
Bypass corridors for Idaho Power's facilities.At tached
hereto as Exhibit 8 is the Eagle Area Idaho Power
Facilities Map dated November 21, 2002 that is referenced
in the City's 2000 Comprehensive Plan , as adopted by the
City on November 9 , 1999 and amended by the City on
February 16 , 2004.In addi tion to those two corridors,
the Star Substation and the proposed Beacon Light
Substation are also illustrated on that map.
Does the Ci ty' s Comprehensive Plan offer
addi tional support for the al ternati ves presented to the
City by Idaho Power?
Yes.The City's 2000 Comprehensive Plan states
that " (aJ ppropriate placement of electric utility
facilities on public rights-of-way is encouraged.Public
streets and road rights-of -way typically serve as
corridors for electric facili ties. The Plan also notes
that " (aJ dditions and improvements to electric utility
facilities that enhance the capacity and reliability of
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
531 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Powe r Company83676
regional resources, particularly when multi-
jurisdictional benefits within the region can be
achieved , should be accommodated.A copy of the portion
of the Ci ty' s Comprehensive Plan from which these quotes
are extracted is attached hereto as Exhibit
Does the City's Comprehensive Plan establish a
City policy directing that Idaho Power's transmission
lines be placed underground?
No.The City's Plan makes no such policy
recommendation and makes no reference to the placement of
the Company's transmission lines underground.
If the route alignments are not the real issue
concerning the parties, what is the issue preventing the
parties from resolving this matter?
The issue before the Commission is who is to
pay for placing underground the transmission and
distribution facilities proposed on any of the alignments
presented to the Ci ty by Idaho Power.Idaho Power
concurs wi th the testimony of Commission Staff member
Lobb who recommends that "the Commission direct the
Company to install overhead facilities unless or until
the City of Eagle provides the incremental difference in
cost required to place those facilities underground.
Lobb Direct at 3, 11 1-Idaho Power's position is that
its ratepayers generally should not pay the incremental
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
532 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
difference in cost for construction standards that are
not implemented wi thin the Company's service terri tory
even wi thin the industry as a whole.
Of the al ternati ves presented to the Ci ty,
which al ternati ve is the best or most acceptable to Idaho
Power?
Based upon input received from the Eagle CAC
regarding the favored route from the perspective of the
community and the perspective of the Company concerning
the ease and ability to construct certain alignments
along wi th the expected cost impacts, Idaho Power
believes the Eagle Bypass Route is the most favorable and
acceptable al ternati ve.
However, as the direct testimony by all the parties
has shown , there are advantages and disadvantages to each
alignment depending upon the unique perspective of the
wi tness testifying. Idaho Power does not deny there may
be impacts, either real or perceived, with any of the
alternative alignments.
As noted in the testimony of Don C. Reading, Ph. D,
witness for the City of Eagle, public opposition toward
overhead power lines and the placement of substations has
increased significantly over the past few years.Fears
of heal th concerns , loss of property value and , most of
all , the aesthetic impacts of the lines have made the
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
533 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
permitting process for transmission lines and substations
increasingly difficul t.The decision of the Eagle City
Council to repeatedly deny, over an extended period of
time, the Company's applications for a Conditional Use
Permit is testimony to this.
Commission Staff member Randy Lobb testified
that "the State Street alignment makes the most economic
sense from the standpoint of the general body of Idaho
Power customers.Lobb Direct at 9, 11 13 -16.Mr. Lobb
bases his assertion on the fact that the existing State
Street overhead distribution line is located in an
established corridor and that the "most logical and
economical al ternati ve is to upgrade existing overhead
facilities . in established utility rights of way.
Does the Company concur with this position?
Yes, Idaho Power generally concurs wi th Mr.
Lobb's assessment.Construction of the 138-
transmission line in the existing overhead alignment
along State Street is comparable in cost to the Eagle
Bypass route; however , complexi ties in construction due
to the required distribution underbuild and the fact that
accommodations have to be made during construction along
this alignment to continue to serve customers reliant
upon the distribution line existing in that corridor will
likely increase the overall cost of construction in thatarea.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
534 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
How does the nature of the work on the Eagle
Bypass route differ from the work that would be required
on the State Street alignment?
Because the new transmission system between the
Eagle and Star substations has to be completed by May
2005, any work during the condensed construction schedule
that involves additional distribution line construction
requiring "hot" work (that is, while the distribution
line is energized and providing service to existing
customers) such as the State Street route al ternati ve,
adds elements of risk to both proj ected costs and the
required completion date.The Eagle Bypass Route offers
the greatest probability that the Company can get the
needed transmission line extension designed and completed
during the short construction schedule and at the least
cost.
However, as I stated earlier in this testimony,
provided that cost recovery issues are appropriately
addressed , Idaho Power can support the State Street
alignment as a solution to this matter.Consistent with
the Company's position , however , if the City wishes the
existing distribution line located along this alignment
to be buried,any costs associated with that additional
requirement will have to be borne by the residents of the
Ci ty of Eagle.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
535 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Did Eagle's CAC endorse the State Street
al ignment ?
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
536 SIKES (Di -Reb) 12a
Idaho Power Company83676
No, it did not.The CAC opposed the State
Street alignment even though the total length of this
alignment is shorter than the other alternatives. The
Eagle CAC and the results of numerous surveys have
indicated that minimizing the presence of transmission
lines in residential areas and reducing the distance that
those 1 ines have to traverse the Ci ty are two of the most
important elements in selecting a route for a proposed
transmission line.
Would the construction of any of the overhead
alternatives suggested by the Company prevent burying
either the distribution or transmission facilities in the
future?
No.Those facilities could be placed
underground at a later date provided the City agrees to
pay for the cost of burying those facilities.
Are you aware of any funding mechani sms
available to the City to finance the cost to underground
these electrical facilities?
This is not my area of expertise but two
al ternati ves have been identified in documents already
filed with the Commission, namely, the Company I
Complaint and the direct testimony of both Company
Witness Greg Said and Commission Staff Witness Randy
Lobb .
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
537 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Both Mr. Said and Mr. Lobb identify the City'
option of creating a Local Improvement District , commonly
known as a LID.Based upon their testimony, it appears
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
538 SIKES (Di-Reb) 13a
Idaho Power Company83676
Idaho Code Title 50 allows mayors and city councils to
create a LID to fund line extensions or to fund
conversion of existing overhead electric facilities to an
underground configuration.The time required to create a
LID , however, may preclude the use of this option in this
instance.
Alternatively, as Mr. Said testified, Idaho Power
may be willing to accept installment payments , with
interest , to recover the cost of burying any facilities
that the City wishes to place underground.The proceeds
of a franchise fee , as permitted by Title 50 of the Idaho
Code , could be directed to pay the cost associated wi
burying the facilities.
Directing your attention to the testimony of
Pike Teinert, a wi tness for the Ci ty, did the Company
consider the use of alternative technologies or Demand
Side Management ("DSM") programs instead of building the
138-kV line as planned by Idaho Power?
Wi tness Teinert talks extensively about ACSS
conductor as an al ternati ve for the present si tuation.
ACSS conductor is basically an aluminum conductor that
has been annealed, or heated to high temperatures.That
process reduces the strength of the metal. As a resul t of
that procedure, the conductor requires addi tional steel
strands to provide the necessary support strength.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
539 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
As such , the tension in the wire is placed on the
steel strands which permits the aluminum to operate at
high temperatures without comparable stretching when
compared to standard conductors.This reduced drooping
or sag caused by elongation of the wires allows reduced
construction heights to maintain required safety
clearances.
Would use of this special conductor allow
either the 138-kV or a 69-kV line to be constructed
overhead through Eagle such that the City's 35-foot
height restriction would not be exceeded?
No. To maintain the required clearances
structures in excess of 35 feet would still be required.
Furthermore , 69-kV voltage is not available within the
City of Eagle.To place a 69-kV line between the Eagle
and Star substations would ultimately require the
addition of at least two $1 000,000 138/69-
transformers to integrate a 69-kV line into the power
grid.One transformer would be required at the Eagle
Substation which does not contain sufficient space to
make this modification.Further , there is insufficient
time to order and receive this custom-manufactured
equipment and to obtain the necessary approval from the
City to make the needed modifications to the Eagle
Substation.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
540 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Witness Teinert suggests that the "Caldwell
69-kV line could be reconductored (with ACSS conductorJ
to mitigate the voltage support problem.Teinert Direct
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
541 SIKES (Di-Reb) 15a
Idaho Power Company83676
16, 11 23-24.Is that a plausible solution to the lssues
facing the Company in this instance?
No, it is not.ACSS technology allows the
conductor to carry more electrical current at a higher
temperature.This technology, in effect, increases
ampaci ty.However , the use of ACSS conductor in this
application would not address the issue of vol tage
support, the limiting factor in the Company's system that
is driving the need to construct the 138-kV transmission
ine through the Ci ty of Eagle.
Moreover , the area I s capacity and reliability
requirements would not be resolved with the application
of ACSS technology.In addition, the use of ACSS
technology would not preclude the eventual construction
of another ine through the Ci ty In that instance, the
Company would potentially face the same impasse with the
City that it confronts with the issue presently before
the Commission.
Can DSM programs realistically address the load
demands in the Eagle/Star area?
Idaho Power agrees that appropriatelyNo.
designed demand-related customer programs can shift or
reduce the peak demand on the electric system.However,
given the amount and concentration of growth in this
area, it is impractical to rely on these types of
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
542 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
programs to fully offset existing loads.For example,
for every house
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
543 SIKES (Di-Reb) 16a
Idaho Power Company83676
added to the area's housing stock , an existing house
would need to be "electrically" removed.This clearly
does not comport wi th ei ther the growth proj ections of
the City or its expansion plans and permitted uses for
the area.
Both Charles Carlise, witness for Eagle River
LLC, and Witness Reading for the City of Eagle cite the
incredible rate with which the City of Eagle has grown.
Can DSM programs alone address the loads demanded by
population increases of those magnitudes?
I don't believe that would be realistic.In my
estimation , a 10% penetration of effective DSM programs
each year would be required to offset a 10% growth rate.
That amount would quickly saturate the market space given
the extent of growth exhibited by the City of Eagle and
surrounding area and the amount of growth predicted in
the future.
Witness Carlise states that the Eagle River
development alone "will bring several thousand jobs to
the Ci ty of Eagle and the surrounding communi ty .
asserts that the development "will employ one person for
every 100 square feet of space , which translates to
approximately 10 000 jobs.WitnessId. at 11 10-12.
Reading notes that the "City of Eagle was the 3rd fastest
growing city in Idaho between 1990 and 2000 increasing
CSB REPORTING
Wilder, Idaho
544 SIKES (Di-Reb)
I daho Power Company83676
its population by 233%.Reading Direct at 3 , 11 19-20.
He observes that " (tJ his
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho 83676
545 SIKES (Di-Reb) 17a
Idaho Power Company
growth has continued since 2000 increasing by nearly
200 residents or an additional 23%.Id. at 11 20-21.
Wi tness Reading provided testimony that
property values were observed to be lower when located
wi thin 1- km of high vol tage ines in Toronto, Canada. Is
there local evidence that power lines have reduced
property values or inhibi ted development?
That is not our experience locally.One need
only drive along Eagle Road in the vicini ty of Fairview
Avenue and McMillan Road to observe thriving development
adjacent to a significantly larger, 230-, power line.
Property in the vicinity of a 138-kV line along Front
Street in Boise is also developing successfully.
Dr. Reading points out, there are many factors which
influence perceived value.
Does this conclude your rebuttal testimony?
Yes , it does.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
546 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
open hearing.
(The following proceedings were had
MS. MOEN:Mr. Chairman , would you like me
to proceed with the live rebuttal of Mr. Sikes at this
time?
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Tha t woul d be
your choice.
MS. MOEN:I think we'll proceed in that
manner.
COMM IS S lONER KJELLANDER:Okay.
BY MS. MOEN:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
(Continued)
Mr. Sikes, you're aware, aren't you, that
some rebuttal testimony and supplementary testimony has
been submitted by the City of Eagle;correct?
Yes.
Do you have a copy of Mr.Teinert' s
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
rebuttal and supplemental testimony in front of you?
Yes, I do.
Would you please turn to page
m there.
In lines 20 to 21, would you read with me,
Mr. Teinert testifies that if the City and the Commission
547 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Staff had known that the new Star substation feed from
Eagle substation was only temporary and that the real
reason for the high capacity 138 kV line was to complete
the Locust Loop No.2, the search for acceptable
solutions would have been much more focused , easier to
analyze, less contentious and significantly less time
consuming.Do you agree with that statement?
No, I do not.
Let's break down Mr. Teinert' s testimony
from the section I just read.First, he claims that the
new Star substation feed from the Eagle substation is
only a temporary solution.Can you explain what the
purposes of the feed between the substation , between the
Eagle and Star substations are?
Yes,and have to admit there s e ems
have been some confusion about what "temporary"means and
obviously, in an integrated system plan in this way,
there are both a long-term and a short-term need that
needs to be met often by different and complimentary
solutions.In the near term, as has already been
discussed in some of the testimony, the immediate need
increased capacity to Star substation; however , in the
long term , this line through the Eagle area proceeding on
to Star fulfills long-term capacity requirements for the
reliability and integrity of the system service to the
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548 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
area.
Now , the Star substation is presently fed
from another source; correct?
Tha t is correct.
And why is it that it needs a second
source?
Right now the Star substation being served
from the 69 kV system from Caldwell through Lansing
voltage limited and the capacity in that system cannot
sustain or continue to serve the continued growth in the
area; therefore, capaci ty increases need to be provided
in the very immediate term for Star substation.The
proposal that we have to extend the 138 kV from Eagle
the lowest cost and most expedient solution to provide
that near - term need.
And is it prudent electrical practices to
have a secondary source to a substation?
Yes.As part of the reliability and
design of the system, albeit there are some areas in our
system that are radially fed , when a significant amount
of load and obviously in these high impact areas, we do
strive to at least in the long term provide for the
opportunity for loop feeds into the areas.
And is it true that in the long term the
source of electricity that the Company would be supplying
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549 SIKES (Di -Reb)
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from Eagle to Star would serve exclusively Eagle
residents with the exception of outages?
Yes, and I think you can even go back to
my rebuttal testimony and I believe it's Exhibit No.
showing the loop that was provided from the City of
Eagle's comprehensive plan and I guess it I S a little bit
easler for me to talk from this picture here.
And what does this Exhibit 8 depict?
It shows where Eagle is in the center of
that document, the line, if we now move to the south to
Locust substation on that document, existing lines go to
the east and then north to what is shown there as HP and
then Jopl in and up around back preceding west to Eagle
and then further to the west to where Beacon Light and
Linder, then back south along Chinden to Locust.That'
the loop that we're talking about and this document has
been out there in the public, obviously is dated for a
significant amount of time, as well as our other plans in
providing that.
The loop, the section that we are building
as a result of this case or we're attempting to build
westerly from Eagle towards the Star substation, that
piece certainly from Eagle to Linder Road fits within the
long-term areas and boundaries of the City of Eagle
exclusively.
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
550 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Thank you.Back to Mr. Teinert I s
testimony on page 6 that I entered into the record here,
he indicates that or concludes that the real reason for
the 138 kV line was to complete the Locust Loop No.
Do you agree with that conclusion?
No, and that statement is really flawed in
its analysis.As I've already said, there were two
There's the short-term reason for gettingreasons.
service to Star , in addition to completing the loop and
both of those issues have been out in front of the public
for a number of years.
And can you plan for a transmission line
from Eagle to Star without looking at the system as a
whole?
What's really difficult about systemNo.
planning in the electrical grid is when you touch one
piece of it, it affects many other pieces.To simply
look at one element of the system, as Mr. Teinert has
suggested , kind of gives you a short-sighted or myopic
view of the capabilities of that system.That one plece
in there is part of the integrated system.I know Mr.
Teinert has tried to characterize Star as just a
distribution substation and as a distribution substation,
that is correct; however , the transmission lines that
feed that area are of a regional basis and fulfill
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regional needs and one cannot just make hip- shot
judgments as to the need and benefit without completely
understanding how the system works.
Let's switch gears here a little bit.
Mr. Teinert in his rebuttal testimony on page 8, more
particularly lines 13 to 22 , he makes references to his
recommended al ternati ve of simply reconductoring the
State Street route as a solution to the problem.First
of all , disregarding the effect that would have on the
system as a whole, can the existing poles along State
Street be used to reconductor this route wi th ei ther ACSS
or ACSR conductor?
No, they cannot.The existing facilities
on the poles, there are two distribution circuits on that
pole right now , to put a 69 or a 138 kV line along that
route requires an additional set of wires, not simply
replacing one of the sets of wires; therefore , the entire
line along that route would still be required to be
rebuilt at an increased height even if 69 kV were to be
used because two distribution circuits and a 69 kV
circui t need to be maintained.
And are there minimum clearances that have
to be met in order to safely maintain those conductors?
Yes, there are, and even if the ACSS
conductor which would allow somewhat reduced clearances
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over the tradi tional ACSR conductor , adding an addi tional
circuit on top of the two distribution circuits would
still require for structural strength as well as for
clearances new pole plant along that route.
Okay; so what you're assuming is that on
the State Street route, any distribution conductors, any
services provided by non-Idaho Power entities and the
transmission line would all be overhead; is that
correct?
MR. SMITH:Mr. Cha i rman ?
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:This is live
rebut tal.You'll get a chance at cross.
MR. SMITH:It is an obj ection to the form
of the question.
COMM IS S lONER KJELLANDER:This is live
rebuttal and what I'm going to allow is live rebuttal.
If this had been submitted in writing, it would be there.
You'd get an opportuni ty to ask for strike after you saw
it or to do redirect or not redirect but an opportunity
to cross, so we're going to wai t for cross, okay?
MR. SMITH:Okay.
MS. MOEN:Just for explanation, I think
Mr. Sikes testified that the existing 69 kV poles would
not be able to accommodate the required conductors and so
I was just clarifying that.
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553 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
BY MS. MOEN:Is it correct that you'
assuming in your response that the present poles could
not accommodate the reconductored 69 kV because other
conductors would al so be present overhead; correct?
Tha t is correct.The existing facilities
that are there need to continue to remain and provide the
service that they are providing today, so nothing goes
away by saying we're going to put another 69 kV ine
through here.
Now , let's look at the long-term picture.
Would the 69 kV reconductored from State Street
- -
State Street between the Eagle and Star substations have
a sufficient, provide a sufficient source of electricity
to the west?
In and of itself the Wlre could be made to
carry the amount of current that would be required;
however , there are several problems associated with that.
Again , the line being rebuilt, assuming it could be
rebuil t overhead as we've just discussed wi th the
remaining distribution circuits and the addition of
another ine, there are the interface points into the
To fulfill the long-term reliabilitysystem.
requirements equivalent to the proposed 138 kV solution
by Idaho Power Company, the step transformer or auto
transformer Mr. Teinert has referred to in the vicinity
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554 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
of or in Eagle substation would be required to have a
capacity of approximately 150 MVA.
Now, that's significantly higher than
maybe what he was thinking of, but even if we were to
assume and use his after-market costs of $6.00 a kW , a
transformer of that Slze would in and of itself be
$900 000.Further , that does not include any
installation costs.That does not include any other
labor.That does not include any protection equipment.
That does not include land or site preparation or
availability or timeliness of actually acquiring and
implementing that as a solution and that is only on the
Eagle end of that proj ect
Again , in the long term , we would be faced
with repeating that on the westerly end, so we would end
up with maybe a $1.5 million voltage change on the Eagle
end , another $1.5 million voltage change on the Star or
Locust route, we would have spent $3 million in just
doing vol tage changes and not covered any distance
whatsoever.It is an extremely costly al ternati ve to
integrate wi th the existing system and that's why you
can't just look at the system as a piecemeal pancake
design.
And concentrating just at the Eagle
substation site, is there sufficient space within that
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555 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
substation to accommodate the transformers that would be
required?
No, there is not and furthermore, the Ci t Y
of Eagle has testified that we are not allowed to upgrade
the substation at that site.
Let's talk about the merits of the ACSS
conductor solution recommended by Mr. Teinert.How long
have you been familiar with this technology?
Oh, I have been familiar with this
technology since the ' 80s.It's certainly nothing new to
me and its application, it is a very good technology when
properly applied in the narrow scope where it really
benefited and intended to be used and that is again,
where you may have an existing transmission line that
needs increased ampaci ty or capaci ty, not necessarily a
voltage change but just more current capacity.
It can carry more current for the same
slze wire with less sag, so if you were to install that
conductor , you could effectively wi thout changing out the
poles or structures of the line increase the capacity of
the system without significant structural rebuild to
accommodate that increased capaci ty; however , that is
simply not the case in the situation we're looking at.
As I've already described, adding another set of wires
would be required and Mr. Teinert seems to have missed
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Idaho Power Company83676
that in his analysis.
So you don't have any qualms with his
description of what ACSS conductor can do?
No.
But is it your contention that use of that
conductor is not applicable in this case?
That is correct.
Mr. Teinert also in his testimony
indicates that or alleges that Idaho Power failed to
share plans with either the City or the public regarding
thi s proj ect What's your experience wi th regard to this
process?
Well , in the first place, I go back to my
Exhibit 8 in the rebuttal testimony that was extracted
from the Eagle City comp plan which clearly shows the
loop.It astonishes me that the City can claim that this
was brand new information to them when they have
incorporated it into their own documents.Further, wi
the public process, the conditional use permits, the
public meetings we have held which many of us have
attended, we have openly discussed and shared those plans
with everyone in attendance.
Furthermore, as part of the presentation
to the CAC, the Citizens Advisory Committee, explicitly
it was discussed that the purposes of this line were
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two- fold:one to meet the near- term needs of Star; and
secondly, to provide ul timately a loop feed back to
Eagle, so this information has been shared and put out
there in the public for years.
There's also been issues about the cost of
the proj ect and that those are not firm.Why is it that
the Company is unable to provide a firm cost at this
time?
Well , certainly to provide a firm cost you
need an engineered design , and secondly, once you have an
engineered design , which can't be done until you know
what the alignment is and as the City in their hiring of
Black and Veatch has discussed, it's expensive to produce
a detailed design which Black and Veatch wasn't even a
detailed design , so the costs of producing a detailed
design are significant, but once you have then a detailed
design , on large proj ects such as this , Idaho Power
typically puts them out to competitive bid.
In putting a project out to competitive
bid, we have no idea what the bidders will come back and
offer as a price to construct that proj ect once they have
a firm design.Furthermore, on their side of the
equation , there are many factors that are involved in
their bid price , one of which is constructibility and
compressed schedule.A compressed schedule such as we
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Idaho Power Company83676
are now facing certainly drives the cost up.Al so,
depends upon how busy they are.
If their resources are fully committed
they lncrease the price because they may or may not be
able to perform the work and if they're going to perform
the work, it's going to cost them more to do it, so all
of those factors, you know , the Ci ty has kind of come
back and blamed on us are really a pass-through and Idaho
Power is unable to determine those prices because how
would get constructed are not determined until after we
receive firm bids.
MS. MOEN:I don't have any further
questions.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Are you ready,
then , to submit your witness for cross?
MS. MOEN:Yes, Mr. Sikes is available for
cross-examination.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay, let's go
first to the Ci ty of Eagle.
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559 SIKES (Di -Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
CROS S - EXAMINA T I ON
BY MS. BUXTON:
Good morning, Mr. Sikes.
Good morning.
You referred to Exhibit 8 as part your
comprehensive plan , where in Exhibit 8 does it explain
how this was all supposed to work as far as looping and
all that, that someone like me could understand?And I'
probably not the average person that's going to be
looking at this, so how would an average person look
Exhibit 8 and understand that this was supposed to be a
looping for Star and Eagle substation , the difference
between Joplin substation , HP , Locust, Beacon Light and
Linder, how would somebody understand that from this
document?
Well, to me just visually looking at, as
think anyone could, they see where either existing line
routes or proposed line routes are and as to the
electrical connectivity or configuration on that, what
people in the public are most concerned is not how the
electrical system operates, it's where are those
facilities and that's clearly demonstrated here.
Were you present at the hearing last night
with the public in Eagle?
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560 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Yes, I was.
So it's your testimony that the public in
Eagle are not interested on how these ines are supposed
to work and be interconnected and how they're supposed to
affect them personally; is that what your testimony is?
You're not telling me what my testimony
My testimony is that the public as you can welllS.
experience when you have publ ic hearings, some people
show up and those people get interested.In the comp
plan process, I don't know how many citizens have
actually reviewed the comp plan or this information.
Well , your testimony is that anybody
looking at this could understand it and that your
testimony, you just said that anybody
MS. MOEN:I obj ect to this line of
questioning.It mischaracterizes the wi tness' --
MS. BUXTON:I'll wi thdraw the question.
BY MS. BUXTON:Is it your testimony that
this document clearly explains the looping proposals by
Idaho Power that a lay person could understand?
I m not sure that the looping proposals
are at issue here.I believe it's what facilities are
planned on the ground.
Mr. Sikes, can you please answer the
question I asked?
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Wilder , Idaho
561 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Powe r Company83676
MS. MOEN:That question I obj ect has been
asked and answered.The question was can a lay person
look at this and understand the looping system.
Mr. Sikes' answer to that question was that a lay person
can look at this and realize the proposed location of the
Company's poles and transmission lines.He did not
indicate that a person would be able to understand the
looping purpose of the location of those poles.
COMM IS S lONER KJELLANDER:Okay, does that
get to the answer of the question that you were asking?
MS. BUXTON:I do not bel ieve it does, but
I will go forward.I don't want us to take all day and
if we want to have evaSl ve answers, I guess then you can
weigh those, that's fine.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Take as much
time as you need.
You testified that had
- -
in looking atBY MS. BUXTON:
Mr. Teinert' s rebuttal on page 6, it was his opinion, and
I quote, "If the City and the Commission Staff had known
that the new Star substation" - - we'll just limit it to
the last paragraph on page 6 which basically says that
had all this information been clearly set forth to both
the City and the Commission Staff that in his opinion
this whole discussion and working through these issues
would have been less contentious, and it's your opinion
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after sitting through the hearing last night and the
hearing yesterday that more information would not have
made this any less contentious?
I don't know about contentious, certainly
less time consuming.It's the Company s responsibility
to design and plan and operate the system.
Mr. Sikes, you testified, and I quote,
that the process would "not be less contentious.Did
you testify to that?
That the process?
This mornlng.
That the process?What
- -
Ms.Moen asked you whether you agreed with
Mr. Teinert' s testimony on page 6 that had this
information been more readily available and more
reasonably and easily explained to the City as well as
the Commission Staff that the search for acceptable
solutions would have been more focused, easier to analyze
and less contentious and significantly less time
Your answer to her was, and I quote, that consumlng.
would not be less contentious.Is that your
testimony?
Not just less contentious.I don't agree
with the whole statement there.
I understand, but you did tell Ms.
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Moen that it would not be less contentious?
I don't bel ieve it would be because Mr.
Teinert has not been able to understand the technical
merits of this in the first place and has continued to
mislead people in the public as to his solution actually
being workable.
And you don't believe that the people last
night nor the testimony yesterday that you have been
misleading about what the real purpose for this is is not
a valid concern for the public from the City of Eagle?
We have been forthcoming in what the real
purpose of this line is.I have already testified to
that and your documents show that.
Well , I guess there's a lot of people
were you present when Council member Sedlacek testified
about her frustration?
Yes.
And so you think she was lying?
No.
Okay.Mr. Sikes, did anyone other than
the Company, either the City, the Commission Staff , Black
and Veatch or even the Ci ty ' s expert Mr. Teinert, provide
an independent analysis of the Lansing-Caldwell 69 kV
ine to Star?
I don't know what other parties have or
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have not done.
Have you seen anything?
No one has presented that to me.
So the only information that's been in
this whole record is information that's been presented by
the Company; is that correct?
As far as I know.
Isn't it true that if the Company had only
initially loaded the Star substation to, let's pick a
number, four megawatts that the system capacity would not
have been reached on August 1st of 2004 conveniently
before this hearing?
You are mischaracterizing the nature of
the load and connectivity in that area.Your question is
flawed.
ka y ,Ie t 's see.So you don't think it'
fair to say that the Company created this crisis by its
own management decisions to load the Lansing-Caldwell
feed to Star sub only within a half a megawatt of its own
capacity?
I really don't appreciate of being accused
of creating a crlS1S.Absolutely not.
And I appreciate that nobody wants to be
accused of saying that they were trying to mislead
anybody, but you're saying that about our expert and the
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citizens of the City of Eagle as well as the City
Council, so I think that this is contentious and it would
have been a whole lot less contentious had we all worked
together.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Excuse me, is
this testimony?
I apologi ze MS. BUXTON:I withdraw that
whole ridiculous thing I said.
BY MS. BUXTON:Isn't it true that you
initially loaded the Star substation at 7.7 megawatts?
Wi thout checking my records, I'll accept
that.
If you'll look at Exhibit, I believe it'
Exhibit 7 of your rebuttal testimony on page 2 , it states
the station
- -
well, wi thout reading everything, the
station will initially have a 28 MVA 69/12.5 kV
transformer with two feeders serving approximately 7.
, which I assume means megawatts; is that correct?
Yes.
I f you look
there;that correct?
at page 4, you have a table
Yes.
On page 3 at the bottom you identify that
table as showing expected loading on the Star feeders and
station in the near future, and in 2004 , you said that
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566 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
would be 8.171 megawatts; is that accurate?
That was the proj ection at the time this
was produced, yes.
What was the date that this document,
Exhibi t 7, was final i zed by the Company?
Most recently, there have been mul tiple
revisions to this, I believe the date shown , and you can
help me find the right page, too, on page 7 of 9, it
shows a finish date of June 3rd, 2004; however , I know of
the preexistence of this document much earlier than that,
but that is not captured in the document here.When I
grabbed this document for production and discovery, I
went out electronically, printed it off.I didn't even
check what date.ve looked at this document or a form
of this document years earlier than this.
Had this document ever been given to the
City of Eagle in the process for the conditional use
application?
I do not know that.
Would you be surprised to know that it had
not?
I don't know if it has or hasn I I know
the contents and details of the plans for the area have
been shared on numerous occasions.
In what manner?
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567 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Through meetings with Idaho Power
representatives and Council members, planning staff , et
cetera, as well as public open houses.
Would it be surprising to you that none of
that's in the record in the meeting notes that I'
reviewed?
No, it wouldn't be surprising to me to
know that people don't always hear what they're shown or
told as well.
Wouldn't it be more fair to say that
people may not understand it and that you're maybe
talking over everybody's head; would that be more fair to
say?
I obj ect to thi s .This isMS. MOEN:
argumentative.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Ms. Buxton.
MS. BUXTON:I '11 go on wi th some other
line of questioning.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay, thank you.
Is it fair to say that theBY MS. BUXTON:
7 megawatts transferred from other lines have not been
completely consumed by the load in Eagle and Star since
you previously acknowledged in your testimony that the
growth in Star and Eagle areas has not been as great as
expected by the Company?
CSB REPORTING
Wilder , Idaho
568 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
I have never said the growth in Eagle and
Star has not been as great as expected by the Company.
That was a mischaracterization by Mr. Teinert of my
testimony.I said the growth in Star was relatively
slower than the other areas --
I 11 accept that, then.
- -
and explained why it was has been
increasing.I did never say it has been slower than we
had expected.In fact, the record shows it has been as
fast or faster than we expected.
So which is it?Was it your first answer
or your second answer?
My first answer says the growth in Star
has been slower relative to Meridian and Eagle areas
because Star is further from the metropolitan areas where
people are commuting.Due to increased prices and
commute distances and other travel time issues, Star is
becoming more of a bedroom community and the growth
being pushed from these areas that have been experiencing
high growth further into Star, so the growth in Star has
been picking up, not been slowing down.
Isn't it true that your , that your load
growth is approximately one megawatt per year in that
area , the Star area; isn't that correct?
That's what our estimate is as well as in
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Wilder , Idaho
569 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Lans i ng .
So what's the actual number?
The actual number from 2003 to 2004 from
the expectation , I believe, was already in my rebuttal
testimony.
So then the document, Exhibi t No., the
Star area study that was completed, finalized on June 3rd
of this year , was inaccurate at the time it was
finalized?
Parts of those studies are updated and
part s are not.That was - - when it was, that date was in
there, I don't know what information was changed on that
or the date that that was done or in fact, I'm not even
sure if that's a field set in the document upon when it'
printed, it prints out on the date that it was printed.
I haven't verified that.All I do know is all of our
documents are dynamic living documents and some of them
are updated more frequently than others and they're just
a snapshot in time of the information that's there.
So is it your testimony, then , that even
though on page 7 of the Star area study, which is Exhibi
7 to your rebuttal testimony, the finish date says June
3rd, 2004 , that I cannot rely on the information that I s
in this document; is that what your testimony is, that
could be inaccurate?
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m saying some of the information in here
could be out of date , yes.
So it was not up to date on June 3rd, the
information in this document?
I would be reasonably certain that not
every piece of information in here is up to date on June
3rd.
And you want this Commission and the City
of Eagle and everybody in this room to rely on this
document, though , anyway; is that correct?
I want them to rely on our expertise since
it is our responsibility to plan and design and operate
the system and this is one of the tools in addition to
the intimate familiarity of the engineers responsible for
this work.
So you use a tool ike thi s to manage the
system that may have inaccurate information in it; is
that your testimony?
I obj ect The quest ion hasMS. MOEN:
been asked and answered.
I think it's a differentMS. BUXTON:
question.
Why don't weCOMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:
gl ve it one more try.
What I'm saying is theTHE WITNESS:
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information in here could be out of date on June 4th or
June 5th or June 2nd.As the other exhibi t in my
documents shows on the
With that informationBY MS. BUXTON:
then --
Mr. Chairman, I'd like toMR . HOWELL:
hear the answer.
So would I.COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:
THE WITNESS:I believe it's Exhibit No.
shows some updated load information for both Lansing and
Star that clearly is different than what's in the
document and yes, it was an August date versus a June
date, but our engineers are busy on many proj ects and
don't update all of these documents as information
changes daily and many times, like I said, I don't know
where the date in that document of June 3rd is actually
coming from.I do know from the evidence we have in
front of us that that load for 2004 is inaccurate to the
peak that has been experienced this summer that occurred
after June 3rd.I t occurred - - it was shown in that
exhibit on August 1st.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Can I interrupt
for just one moment?
MS. BUXTON:I only have one other ine of
questioning and then I'm finished and we're going to a
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I daho Power Company83676
different topic.
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Okay, how about
if we
- -
what I'd like to do is take about a ten-minute
break and then we'll come back and that may give you an
opportunity, too, to look over some of your questions and
perhaps maybe for us to just sort of settle in just a
little bit more this morning, so we're going to take a
ten-minute break and go off the record and we'll all come
back in ten minutes and we'll move forward.
(Recess.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay, we'll go
back on the record and, Ms. Buxton , you were ln your
cross-examination.
MS. BUXTON:Thank you.
BY MS. BUXTON:Mr. Sikes, is it the
Company's plan after constructing this proj ect to double
circuit the lines?
Which lines?
For thi s proposal.
Through Eagle?
Yes.
For the transmission portion?By "double
circui t," I'm not sure if you mean distribution or
transmission.
It's transmission , I believe.
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No.
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Ms. Buxton , is
your mi rophone on?
MS. BUXTON:No.
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Thank you.
MS. BUXTON:Do I need to repeat that?
THE WITNESS:Let me rephrase my answer to
that, too.The section along State Street out to Star
substation is not planned to be double circuit.As shown
on that facilities map, I believe is that Exhibit 8, the
section proceeding
Road up to Beacon
double circui t.
Light and Linder is proposed to be
north from State Street along Linder
Is that consistent withBY MS. BUXTON:
what's Exhibit 114 which is your 10-year transmission
plan?If you don't have a copy of that, I have an extra
copy.
I believe I still have a copy of that and
I believe that is consistent.
Can I refer you to page 1 of Exhibit 114,
please?In paragraph 2 , the second sentence says, "A
brief assessment of the 75-year study of November 2001
includes new assumptions about the rights-of -way using
more double circuits for public impact than single
circuits for reliability ; so does that mean that where
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you can put a double circuit on it you will for
reliability?
What that statement is saying is in rights
of way if you don't double circuit the lines and the same
number of circuit miles are required throughout the area,
then you're spreading basically a line down every road,
so where you can create a corridor by double circuiting
the transmission lines, that reduces and confines the
public impact to a smaller area.
ka y; so --
And those are only double circuited where
they're needed.
So is it your testimony that you won't
need to double circuit this proposed line in the
future?
Along that section of State Street, no.
just testified from State Street north on Linder, the
plan would be to double circuit that to make the
electrical loop.
So we could depend on your testimony today
that those lines would not be double circuited in the
future?
For the conditions that we are planning
for today, that is correct.None of us can foresee the
future indefinitely, but based upon our long-term vision
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575 SIKES (X-Reb)
I daho Power Company83676
we do not foresee the requirement at this time.
If you plan to double circuit those
because of future condition changes, would the Company be
required to go back to the Ci ty of Eagle and give them an
opportuni ty to make a decision whether they would want
that or not?
I believe so.
Mr. Sikes , as we've heard through all
these proceedings, both the Company and the Commission
want and strive for cheap electrici ty; is that correct?
I missed part of that.I heard the cheap
electrici ty.
We all want cheap electrici ty, I want
cheap electrici ty, too, I think that's fair to say, but
in pursuing cheap electrical power and providing cheap
electrical power at the lowest cost possible, would it be
the Company s position that if you had, if pink poles
were the cheapest poles you could put someplace that they
could just come to the Commission and be able to use
cheap pink poles and violate or avoid any other color
schemes or any other local land use requirement for
something less obtrusive?
No, and that's why we go through a public
process in implementing these proj ects to try and
ascertain the will of the public to the best that we can.
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I suppose if the public came back and said we did want
pink poles , we'd seriously consider that, but to date, we
haven't had anybody request pink poles.
questions.
MS. BUXTON:I have no further
from the stand.
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Thank you.
Let's move to Mr. Sikes - - Mr. Squyres.
MR. SQUYRES:You better excuse Mr. Sikes
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:I s there
anything you would like to ask Mr. Squyres, Mr. Sikes?
that.
MR. SQUYRES:m not sworn.
BY MR. SQUYRES:
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:We can change
CROSS - EXAMINATION
Mr. Sikes, you filed your rebuttal
testimony, I think , on September 7th or thereabouts, just
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Wilder, Idaho
I believe that's correct.
And in connection with your rebuttal
testimony, you reviewed and commented on the testimony
a few days ago?
from Mr. Lobb?
577 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
I f you could point me to
Sure , I'm on page 12, line 17 of your
rebut tal.
Okay, I'm there.
Okay, and you were in the courtroom
- -
the
Hearing Room yesterday when Mr. Lobb testified that in
his view , the most economical and the route that made the
most sense ln his opinion was the State Street route?
Yes , and I'd also point out that that'
the first route that Idaho Power tried a conditional use
permit on as well.
And that's the conditional use permit
request that was ultimately withdrawn?
Tha t 's correct.
But Idaho Power concurs with Mr. Lobb' s
testimony and assessment; is that correct?
The State Street is the most direct route.
From a constructibility standpoint because of the
encumbrances already existing there, you know , and
don't want to mischaracterize anybody' s representation on
the Bypass, from a purely technical construction
standpoint, it's really easy to go down a clean Bypass in
building the line.That may or may not be the best
solution , but from just going to build it, that's the
easiest proj ect to build.
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578 SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
But in Exhibi t 3 to the Complaint , Exhibi t
4 to your testimony, you've got the cost of option
which was the Bypass, and option 2 , which was the State
Street route, as exactly the same?
Right , and largely for those issues and
that's why we're ultimately I don't want to say apathetic
to the route by any means, but somewhat indifferent to
which solution is ultimately put in play.
But I mean , you testified on rebuttal that
Idaho Power generally concurs with Mr. Lobb' s assessment
that the most logical and economical al ternati ve is
upgrade the existing overhead facilities and established
rights of way and that was down the State Street
corridor; correct?
I believe so.
Thank you, sir.No furtherMR. SQUYRES:
questions.
Okay.COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Let'
see, Mr. Howell.
MR . HOWELL:Thank you, Mr. Cha i rman .
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SIKES (X-Reb)
Idaho Power Company
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83676
CROS S - EXAMINA T I ON
BY MR. HOWELL:
Good morning, Mr. Sikes.
Good morning.
Did you attend last night's public
hearing?
Yes , I did.
Were you in the room when all the publ ic
witnesses testified?
Yes was.
Then you'd agree wi t h me,wouldn'you,
that several the public citizens who testified last
night made suggestions or references to a description
I'll say for poles that look like trees?
Yes,or camouflage.
Or camouflage.
Yes.
Have you ever had or has the Company had
an opportunity to examine the use of those kinds of
camouflaged poles or trees?
We have explored those issues in the past
and technically one of the problems in using, and I'll go
back to some of the references from San Diego, palm tree
types of designs, it is our understanding as well as our
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580 SIKES (X-Reb)I daho Power Company83676
steel pole manufacturer's understanding that there are no
live electrical structures of that type of aesthetic
design anywhere in the nation certainly that they have
produced.
Cell towers, yes, there are a lot of fancy
tree-looking cell towers that have been produced, even by
that manufacturer that we use for steel poles, but they
and Idaho Power are not aware of any of those, and I'
got to tell you from my involvement in IEEE , the
Insti tute of Electrical and Electronic Engineers, as well
as all the trade magazines, I'm certain I would have seen
that as a cover shot photograph if that was around.
Let me ask you about, there was another
suggestion made last night if the Company were to embark
or to be ordered to bury the lines that maybe a more
cost-effective method would be construct those vaults
aboveground and then berm dirt over them.Do you
remember that testimony?
Yes, I do.
Do you have any reaction to that
suggestion?
I think it's a very creative suggestion.
I do think not being specifically on the civil
engineering and design, the amount of civil work to berm
up and bury something versus trench down and bury
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something, I don't know if they're comparable or not, so
outside of that, it could be an option.I don't know nor
necessarily have a professional opinion in one direction
or another if berming versus digging is a better idea.
In your preparation for this case, did you
have a chance to review the Black and Veatch report?
It has been a long time since I reviewed
it.
Well , let me represent to you and assume
for a moment that the Black and Veatch report has a
figure of reinforced concrete in Figure 1 of Exhibit 115
on page 7 of a concrete vault with holes in it for
conduits and in this particular configuration, which
three feet tall by four feet wide, across the bottom they
have four six- inch condui ts
- -
can I approach the
witness?
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Sure.
(Mr. Howell approached the wi tness.
Thank you.THE WITNESS:
They have four six-inchBY MR. HOWELL:
conduits across the bottom.They have another six-inch
conduit on the left and they have a number of other
smaller conduits which I assume to be for distribution.
If we were to use a configuration like that three by four
configuration of vaults and conduits, for just the line
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SIKES (X-Reb)
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that you want to put in , which is three conductors 138
, would we need a vault of that dimension or size with
tha t many condui t s
No.
So we could, if you were building that
use something much smaller?
Yes.
How many six-inch conduit holes do you
think would be required in a typical buried vault 138 kV
situation?
I'd say from a prudency standpoint
you're golng to have three cables going through it, you
might want at least four ducts.
All right.
Thank you.I have no further questions.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Let's move to
questions from the Commission.
EXAMINATION
BY COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:
And I guess I'd ike to pose one up front.
Back to the camouflage issue with the steel towers, if
you can do it for cell towers, why isn't being done for
transmission towers?I s there something unique and
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583 SIKES (Com-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
different about the structure that makes it impossible to
have paint adhere to it correctly?
From a painting standpoint, no.From
designing it as a tree with branches and other
structures , yes.The maj or difference between a bare
conductor electrical line , be it ei ther transmission or
distribution , is the clearances and insulation required,
so to paint a structure , we have painted structures or
the rusted core tin steel structures to give different
looks to those structures already and yeah , painting them
different colors , not being an elk hunter myself , I'
assuming you could use the hunting camouflage, too , but
that type of a pattern break-up in the paint does create
a visual break-up that would make things less noticeable
so that type of work in painting can certainly be done.
So if it were, not in this instance, but
let's say you had an alleyway that had a lot of brick
bui Idings nearby, you could, in essence , make it look
like a brick tower?
Yes.
So that's not impossible , but in terms of
shaping it, then you run into some other issues?
Right, and then you get into the
structural integri ty.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay, thank you.
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584 SIKES (Com-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
Any other questions?Commissioner
Hansen?
COMMISSIONER HANSEN:I just have one
question.
EXAMINATION
BY COMMISSIONER HANSEN:
Last night at the hearing, I believe it
was the Ci ty Council lady that talked about a proposal of
routing, I believe , from the Star or, excuse me, from the
Eagle substation southwest along, over by Albertson'
back of Albertson's and then down and across and then up
and it sounded like it would probably be satisfactory or
favorable , more favorable, to the Ci ty to do that and
also compromise on the cost so it wouldn't be 5 or $6
million more because it would just be a short route and
then through that area.Does Idaho Power , were you
earlier aware of that proposal from negotiations with the
Council and if you'd heard about it earlier , do you have
obj ections to that or was last night the first time you'd
heard that?
Yes, Commissioner Hansen , it's not the
first time we have either internally discussed that or
maybe even externally.m not sure if that specific
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585 SIKES (Com-Reb)
Idaho Power Company83676
alignment was reviewed by the Citizens Advisory Committee
or not, if that was one of the alternatives that they had
considered, but we have looked at ways to get through
that down the alley and over to, as was discussed by the
Councilwoman last night, out past Zamzow's and then head
west along there.Again, technically, I'd say that's a
doabl e thing.There are potentially some issues, again
with clearances and locations of the structures.There
are several streets to jog around even to get to
Albertson's, et cetera, but I'm here to tell you wi thout
consultation with my transmission design engineer that
it's probably doable.
Do you have any idea how much cost savings
that would be by going that route versus, say, burying
the entire length through there?
I don't have a good estimate.I do know
that due to the configurations and the streets and
possibly the number of corners that would have to be
turned or the diagonal, there would be more dead-end
structures required for structural strength supporting
the wires and those typically cost a lot more than the
tangent ones, but relative to the entire length of the
Bypass from Edgewood to there, I'm going to say that
would at least be comparable, if not cheaper.I don'
know exactly how much , though.
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586 SIKES (Com-Reb)
Idaho Powe r Company83676
One last question.I had several people
come up last night after the hearing and they talked
about the possibility of paying for it if it was buried,
but they wanted to know how much.Would it be $5.00 more
a month on their bill?Would it be $50.00 a month more
on their bill?They had no idea and I guess my question
is so those people have an opportunity to really make
that decision , when would the Company know exactly the
cost to do that?And I guess what you said earlier , do
you make the decision and then you know the cost or would
you know the cost and then could make the decision?And
it sounds like those people don't know what the real cost
is, so it's a real dilemma, can we afford to do this,
we'd like to do this, but can we afford to do it and
nobody has told us what it's going to cost us.
Thank you, Commissioner.have to go
to the City on
a firm bid from
back in that the information we provided
the cost of burying the distribution was
the Company to the City, so those costs were fixed to the
City, so that was a definitive number given to them.
Idaho Power regardless of the actual costs bore the risk
of what the actual construction costs would come in , so
the Ci ty did have a firm cost for the proposal and the
ambigui ty of the actual cost still remains as I'
already discussed.
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COMMISSIONER HANSEN:Thank you.
believe that's all I have.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Commissioner
Smi th.
COMMISSIONER SMITH:Thank you.
EXAMINATION
BY COMMISSIONER SMITH:
Commissioner Hansen actually asked my
question , but I'm going to ask one more and that is how
long would it take you to get to the Commission your ball
park estimate of taking it from the Eagle substation
south , southwest to the corner of Eagle Road and the
Bypass and from there west along the Bypass?
Certainly not to sound evasive, there are
two parts of that.The cost of construction , I think
that could be estimated relatively quickly and in fact, I
could probably grab somebody and we could throw
together yet today.The uncertainty around that would be
right-of-way acquisition from the private property owners
along that route and that's where some uncertainty to the
cost or even its availability might push things around.
Well, I can live with that, but as I drove
through the town last night, it seemed to me that there
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is what looked to be almost a corridor like the one
that's north of State Street south of State Street out of
that substation.
Yes.
So it looked to me like it's partly there.
Well , I'd be interested in that number
Okay, we'll get that to you.
- -
because I guess that just brings me to
my other comment , which I guess in this case applies to
Idaho Power , but certainly Idaho Power is not the only
utility that I've seen this happen with and the fact is
that you have a proj ect you need to build and yet
somehow in this process you have managed to alienate and
antagoni ze the very people you're trying to serve and for
whom your whole business depends and I just don'get it,
and like say,it's not just Idaho Power and it'
happened over and over in the years sat here,
don't know what it is about utilities and what they do
when they go to these meetings , but you guys need to
change your attitude or your approach or something so
cases like this never get to the Commission , and this is
not personal against you , Mr. Sikes, but it's just, I
guess , a place where I can express my frustration that I
have to go to public hearings and listen to people say
this arrogant company is going to roll over us , they
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Idaho Power Company83676
don't listen to us and they don't care.
Now maybe it happens that for technical
reasons or costs or any other reason you can't do what
they want,but they certainly don't have to feel ike you
didn't listen , you didn't understand and you didn't
explain why for technical , money or other reasons they
can't be accommodated.It's like the whole camouflage
thing.This Councilwoman says she was laughed at instead
of the very reasonable answer you gave us today which
we've already looked into that.If we were a cell tower
we'd be able to do it, but for electric towers the most
we can do is paint.
To me , I think people would understand
that answer instead of you're all wet , go jump in the
lake , so I guess I'm just expressing a little bit of
frustration and not just with this Company and this case.
I don't understand what goes on in a utility's mindset
when they're trying to get something and it's almost like
you're shooting yourself in the foot.
I appreciate those comments, Commissioner
and not offensively, I do take it personal because I too
go through the same pain as you and as a solution , I
think that's what we are trying to work toward is it
would be in everyone's best interests if all of these
issues were accommodated through the language and the
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intent of the local planning act of where we were able to
do this through the comp plan process rather than the
conditional use permitting process , because we'
basically in the position of having to kind of appear to
have made a decision to even approach , to seek approval
which does exactly what you said, here's what you'
doing and you have no voice, and our hope is to continue
to improve those relationships with the jurisdictions to
get those issues resolved and in the public in more of a
public participation process in selecting these corridors
and routes rather than the Company coming forward wi th a
request for a permit saying here's what our decision
lS.
COMMISSIONER SMITH:Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Thank you.
EXAMINATION
BY COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:
Commissioner Smith's question and the
answer that was given sparked another question from
and that is, we've been teed up wi th thi s spec i f i c case
saying that there's a sense of urgency, that this thing
needs to be buil It's brought to us and we're left
wi th a decision of picking a route or moving on the
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motion to dismiss and just throwing our hands up and
saying stop the boats, but assuming that the sense of
urgency is perceived as real by this Commission and we
move forward and kick out an order and we pick a path
does that mean for you that you just move forward with
that path as quick as you can with no more negotiations
or if we were to issue an order , does Idaho Power then
sit down and say but now , wait a minute, what about
another corridor opportunity, what about some of the
right -of -way issues , can those quickly be resolved, to
look at some of those other issues or do you just move
forward and start to plow ground or do you also work wi
the City if we were to pick a path and then say now, what
can be done with burying that path , does it stop for
Idaho Power and you just move forward or is there still
room for negotiation?
I guess my personal hope would be, I think
more what you're insinuating is if it's pretty clear and
the testimony lines up and everyone kind of says none of
us like this, but can we move forward, I'd hope there'
still room to be accommodating.My biggest concern from
my responsibility to get the service out there to Star
prior to next summer's peak load season is I would hope
that the decision, whatever that is, is something that
Idaho Power can immediately move upon because of the time
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constraints that we're under.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Okay, thank you.
Commissioner Hansen has another question.
EXAMINATION
BY COMMISSIONER HANSEN:
Well , I guess just one follow-up on what I
discussed with you earlier and Commissioner Smith
followed up with you on getting back to us with
information.I guess in my mind , I would like hopefully
before we have to make a decision on this that
information that was requested as far as rerouting it as
we talked about up by Albertson's and through that way
and even an estimate of doing that job even though maybe
there may be a question or two on access, right of way or
whatever , but I would hope
- -
I guess my question would
, how soon would you be getting back with us on that
because I think that's something I would defini tely want
to consider?
I would view that as you'll get the best
estimate five-minute answer, not a five-month answer from
a full design.Like I said, I would hope that we could
even get that back yet today.
And just one follow-up.Let's just say,
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for example, the Commission would order that route, would
that have a drastic effect on the timetable of getting
that implemented, I guess, by 2005, next year , as you
planned?
For the things wi thin Idaho Power'
control , I would say I don't bel ieve so.Again, back to
the right of way or if there were other parties who for
some reason sought to stop that from happening, I can'
speak for them.
COMMISSIONER HANSEN:Thank you.That'
all I have.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Let's move to
redirect.
MS. MOEN:I just have a few questions.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. MOEN:
Looking at that proposed alignment that
Ms. Sedlacek suggested at last night's meeting, you would
have to cross over some private property; is that
correct?
That's my understanding.
Including Albertson's; correct?
Either that or I don't know that there'
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room for overhang easements in the public road rights
way in that area, but those are the types of things we
could explore through there.
And in your experience , how difficult is
it to negotiate easements with private property owners?
In some cases, it can take years.
So that could be an impediment to that
al ignment to get thi s on ine by May of 2005?
Right, and I'm going to speak in an area
m a little bit unfamiliar with , I'm going to say absent
the condemnation.
On Exhibit 4 that was referenced by some
of the parties in their cross-examination of your
rebuttal testimony, we looked at Exhibit No.4 which
identifies the costs of the various scenarios.
Yes.
Is it right that the cost to the Ci ty of
Eagle represented a not-to-exceed cost?
That is correct.It was a firm
not-to-exceed cost.
So if Idaho Power's estimates either
exceeded or were less than those represented here , that
was not golng to change or have any effect on what the
City of Eagle paid?
That'correct.
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595 SIKES (Di-Reb)
Idaho Powe r Company83676
Mr. Howell made reference to the Black and
Veatch study and to the vaults and you indicated that
that would be a option the Company could perhaps utilize.
Not to get anybody' s hopes up, but do you know whether
the existing easements and rights of way that the Company
has in place in order to place its transmission lines
would entitle the Company to place a vault aboveground?
I do not know that and certainly along the
State Street alignment in the existing inner urban right
of way, I think that's a landscaping issue alongside of
the road , but I don't know a good answer to that.
So that's still an unknown?
Yes.
And then the last question I have is we'
encountered in August of this year what's been labeled a
crisis situation in the Star-Lansing lines where we have
reached and almost exceeded capacity at those particular
substations.Would we have reached that crisis situation
had this 138 transmission line been constructed between
Star and Eagle?
No.
MS. MOEN:I don't have any further
questions.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Thank you, and
believe we're ready to excuse this witness.Thank you
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for your testimony.
(The wi tness left the stand.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:And that brings
us, I bel ieve , to the end of your case and we'
exhausted the number of wi tnesses, so I think at this
point we're ready to, I guess, revisit the issue we had
initially which was the motion to dismiss and typically
the way that this Commission will deal with that motion
since we've had some spiri ted discussion on that already
is when we begin to deliberate , that will be the first
item that we take up and we'll issue a decision on that
as ei ther the only piece of an Order or as part of a
larger Order , depending on how things shake out in the
course of deliberation, so we just wanted to bring you up
to speed with regards to that specific motion so that you
knew what to expect and some time line to perhaps
understand that we won't be issuing anything today or
tomorrow on that.
MR. SMITH:There was a little background
noise and my hearing is not what it used to be , you
indicated that the motion is submitted and under
consideration , that we'll not do further argument or
briefing on it?
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:, we haven't
gotten to briefing yet , but that's just the way that we
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intend to deal wi th it.If there's a request for briefs
and additional comment on briefs, then that's what we'll
entertain next under this heading.
Is there anything else to come before the
Commission?
MR . HOWELL:Mr. Cha i rman .
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Yes.
MR . HOWELL:Not to belabor the point, but
since the Commission apparently has requested the Company
supply some addi tional proj ected costs on the new
al ignment going through the parking lot, I bel ieve one of
the other public witnesses last night pointed out that
there is a drainage di tch easement which I guess from my
perspective was only visible by the time I got to a
blow-up of this size.That drainage ditch easement runs
roughly from the south of the substation in a westerly
direction and then follows this tree line on the
northwest corner of the intersection of Eagle Road and
the Bypass and I guess what I would recommend for your
consideration is if the City or the Company is going to
look at an alignment that maybe they take the opportunity
to contact the ditch district and discuss if that
alignment usage would be possible.
MS. BUXTON:For the record, that is
Drainage District No.
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COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Thank you
Mr. Howell.
Are there any other matters to come before
the Commission?
COMMISSIONER SMITH:m confused.We'
had the motion to dismiss and the memorandum in support,
but the other parties haven't replied to that and I would
appreciate getting either memos or briefs or even oral
argument, whatever they're prepared to do as soon as
they're prepared to do it so we have their perspective on
that motion.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:That's what I
was hoping to get out of counsel when he asked about
briefs.This is the time to bring that up.
MR. SMITH:Well , Mr. Chairman, again , we
filed that at the last minute , I fully understand and
appreciate that as a matter of fairness , I think opposing
counsel if they have a different viewpoint on that
deserve an opportunity to respond to it.I ha
absolutely no obj ection to allowing them to do so.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:At the beginning
of this hearing when we were dealing with this specific
issue, there was a discussion at least tossed around
about briefs, so this is the time.If you want briefs,
let'- - we're not going to go begging for them.
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MS. MOEN:Respectfully, Idaho Power does
have a different viewpoint on the motion to dismiss and
would like to submit a brief in support of its
position.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Are there other
items that need to be briefed?
MS. BUXTON:Mr. Chairman
- -
go ahead
Mr. Squyres.
MR. SQUYRES:On the motion to dismiss
issue , Mr. Chairman , I just want to advise everyone that
we will not be filing a brief.I'll stand on the
statements I made orally, I believe it was yesterday
morning, which is as the si tuation exists now and we'
done some work in this area before getting here, as the
si tuation exists now , if the State Street corridor , if an
order is issued on the State Street corridor , then our
view is that you don'
- -
you avoid that issue about
trumping an existing order , so I would just go back to
what I said yesterday, but we will not be filing any
briefs.
Thank you, Mr. Cha i rman .
MR . HOWELL:Mr. Cha i rman .
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Yes.
MR . HOWELL:I had mentioned , I believe,
at the beginning of yesterday's hearing that the Staff
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600 COLLOQUY83676
prepared to provide the Commission with oral argument in
opposi tion to the motion to dismiss.I would defer to
your ruling whether you would like to have that oral
argument now or I can put it in writing in a brief.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Let's put it in
the form of a brief.
MR . HOWELL:Okay.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:I s there
anything else that needed to go into the brief or are we
ready to talk about a time line for those briefs?
MR. SMITH:Mr. Chairman , may I make one
comment in response to Mr. Squyres?He's indicated he
does not wish to file a responsive brief vis-a-vis the
State Street al ternati ve, to make clear the intent that
was expressed in the motion , at the time of the filing of
the Complaint by Idaho Power, there was no final decision
by the Ci ty as to the State Street or the Bypass
al ternati ve , so I wish to make that clear on the record
and if Mr. Squyres chooses at some point to submit a
brief , I have no opposition to that if he wants to
reconsider it at some later point.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Let's look to a
time line on this.What I'd like to avoid is actually
getting into quasi oral arguments right now on this issue
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and I think we're sort of headed down that path if we
keep going back and forth.I appreciate what we have on
the record right now and we look forward to the briefs so
we can wade through that , but why don't we try to get a
time line in terms of filing the briefs and do we have
any date in mind?
MS. MOEN:I would suggest no later than
Friday of next week.
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Does Friday of
next week work for everyone?
MR.HOWELL:It works for the Staff.
COMM IS S lONER KJELLANDER:Okay; so Friday
of next week with the filing of the briefs.We look
forward to that.
I s there any other matter that needs to
come before the Commission today?
MR. SMITH:Mr. Cha i rman .
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Yes.
MR. SMITH:A reply brief the week after,
if necessary.Mr. Chairman, we've gone through direct,
rebuttal , I think if a
- -
let me say this:I have no
design and no desire on filing a reply brief because
think we've adequately expressed in our opening brief
exactly what the issue is.On the chance that a new
issue is raised in a responsive brief , I would feel it my
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602 COLLOQUY83676
obligation to respond or reply to that; however, I'm not
going to ask at this time that we have to do a reply
until we see the responses.If it's the Chair I s desire,
I will request the opportunity to file the reply, but I
will do so only if I deem it absolutely necessary as
opposed to having a fixed date for a reply.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:Are there any
comments?
MS. MOEN:Idaho Power has no obj ection to
them filing a reply brief if they find it necessary, but
would recommend that it be done the Wednesday following
submission of the Commission's and Idaho Power'
memorandums in opposi tion.
COMMISSIONER SMITH:You mean Staff?
MS. MOEN:Yes, the Staff, thank you.
COMMI S S lONER KJELLANDER:Any other
All right; so if we're clear , then , the briefscomments?
will be filed next Friday by the end of business, 5: 00
p . m. woul d be the deadl ine , and then if there is a need
for a reply brief, it might be good just for you to
contact Mr. Howell to let him know it's coming, but the
target time line would be Wednesday at the end of
business, which would be 5: 00 p. If that's agreeable
to everyone, then, I think at least we have that issue
put together.
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MR. SMITH:That is agreeable to the Ci ty.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:I s there
anything else that needs to come before the Commission?
MR. SMITH:Not by the Ci ty of Eagle.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER:All right, well,
I want to thank everybody for your patience, your time
and your effort and we look forward to getting those
briefs and moving forward with the decision on this case
so again , thank you and we are adj ourned.
(All exhibits previously marked for
identification were admitted into evidence.
(The Hearing adjourned at 11 :40 a.
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T I C T I O
This is to certify that the foregoing
proceedings held in the matter of Idaho Power Company,
Complainant , versus Ci ty of Eagle, Idaho , Respondent
commencing at 9: 30 a. m., on Thursday, September 9 and
continuing through September 10 , 2004 , at the Commission
Hearing Room , 472 West Washington, Boise, Idaho, is a
true and correct transcript of said proceedings and the
original thereof for the file of the Commission.
Accuracy of all prefiled testimony as
originally submitted to the Reporter and incorporated
herein at the direction of the Comission is the sole
responsibility of the submitting parties.
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CONSTANCE S. BUCY /
Certified Shorthand Reporter K187
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605 AUTHENTICATION
83676