20171222Hearing Transcript.pdf

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BEFORE THE IDAHO PUBLIC UT]I]TIES COMMISSION
IN THE MATTER OF THE
APPL]CATION OF AV]STA
CORPORATION DBA AVISTA
UTIL]TIES FOR AUTHORITY
TO INCREASE ]TS RATES
AND CHARGES FOR ELECTRIC
AND NATURAI GAS SERV]CEIN ]DAHO
REPORTED BY:
JULIE MCCAUGHAN, C.S.R. NO. 684
NOTARY PUBL]C
CASE NO. AVU-E_17-01
AVU-G-17-01
lfDnrrilnRn n
TRANSCRIPT OF PUBLIC HEARING
HELD ON NOVEMBER 30, 20]-1
AT THE MIDTOWN CENTER MEETING ROOM
1505 NORTH sTH STREET
COEUR DIALENE, IDAHO
6: 00 P. M.
BEFORE COMMISSIONER PAUL KJELLANDER
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Coeur d'Alene, ldaho
Northern Offices
208,765.1700
1.800.879.1700
Spokane, Washington
509.455.4515
1.800.879.1700
www.mmcourt.com
Boise, ldaho
Southern Offices
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COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Good eveni-ng,
Iadies and gentlemen. Can you hear me okay?
Thank you. My name is Paul Klellander. f'm
the chairman of this case. f 'm a commi-ssioner with the
Idaho Public Utilities Commission. f'm one of three
commi-ssioners. The other two commissioners will be able
to review the transcript from tonight's hearing. We
have a court reporter who will- be taking down everythj-ng
we say verbatj-m. She's promised, though, that if I say
anything foul, she wil-l- use it phonetically so no one
will get in trouble. She's not in total agreement this.
This evenj-ng, the way the proceeding works
is, in a few moments, we have a list of those of you who
have signed up to provide your public testimony tonight.
Matt Evans, who is in the back -- Matt, raise your hand.
There's afso for those of you that may have come in
and haven't yet signed onto a sheet, there's a sheet
that you can sign up on there. And how we'Il- work
through tonight is just sort of on a
first-come/first-serve basis. Ir11 call your name,
you'11 come forward to the witness stand over there.
The microphone should be on. I think the room is small
enough that you shoufd be able to hear people well, but
we do have a microphone system to move things forward.
As I cal-l- you up, the first thing that we will- do is
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have the Deputy Attorney General representing the
staf f in this case, Sean Costel-l-o, will I'11 f irst
swear you in, and it wil-l 90, "Do you swear or affi-rm
that the testimony you are about to provide wil-l- be the
whol-e truth and nothing but the truth?" The answer to
that is "Yes." And then Sean wil-l ask you just a few
quick questions to get you officially on the record.
He'.1-I ask you your name and have you spe1I it of f iclally
for the record so that we have it 1n the transcript,
he'Il ask you your address, and then if you're a
customer of Avista. And then at that point, you'11 be
asked to provide your statement for the record.
So officially, this proceeding this is
the time and place for the public hearing in Case No.
AVU-E-71-Ot, and AVU-G-1701, al-so known as In The Matter
of the Application of Avista Corporation dba Avista
Utillties for Authority to Increase its Rates and
Charges for Electric and Natura1 Gas Service in Idaho.
Just as far as what's in front of us with
regard to the caser oo December 8, there is a schedul-ed
technical hearing for the proposed settl-ement that has
been filed in rel-ationship to this rate case, and that
date, December B, also represents the cl-ose of the
public comment period. So if tonight, after you
provided your public testimony, you think of something
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efse that you would like to submit for the official
record, there will be an opportunity to go on our
website and actually fill out some additional comment
section that wil-l be a part of the offlcial- record for
this case. So again, the intent tonight is to take your
public statement, to get it officially in the record,
and our job is to help facilitate that process.
So why don't we begin wlth and I
apologize if I butcher anyone's name, which is code for
I will probably make a mistake on every name. Terry
Bostick. Terry, if you coul-d come up here, we'11 get
you sworn in. Right over there. And if you wouId,
Terry, could you just speak into the mike just very
quickly.
TERRY BOSTICK: Of course.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Good, it's
working. Terry, could you raise your right hand? Do
you swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to
provide will be the truth, the whol-e truth, and nothing
but the truth?
MR. BOSTICK: I do.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And
let's see if we can get Mr. Costello to ask you a couple
questions to get you official-1y on the record.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you, Mr. Bostick.
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Would you state your full name and spell your fast name?
MR. BOSTICK: My 1ega1 name is Terrell,
T-e-r*r-e-1-I, Bostick, B-o-s-t-i-c-k.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you, Mr. Bostick. And
what is your residence address?
MR. BOSTICK: 2933 East Spring View Drive,
Coeur d'Alene.
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
Avista Utilities?
MR. BOSTICK: Oh, yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And do you have a
statement you'd like to make?
MR. BOSTICK: A short one, yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease go ahead.
MR. BOSTICK: I'd just like to sdy, to begin
with, I've been a customer of Avista, sj-nce it was
Washington Water Power, which is a considerable number
of years d9o, and I'd al-so l-ike to say that we do
appreciate the services of Avista and the energy
conservatj-on efforts that they have made in the past and
continue to make as a with regard to home energy. I
do have some concerns with regard to the issue around
rate paying, and I say that as a again, dS an
investor in utility stocks and in energy companies, and
as a rate payer for Avista. Going onlj-ne and looking at
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the information that f've seen, I do understand that we
do need some infrastructure changes, everything from
substations to transmission l-ines. I can see that. But
I do have some issues about the Colstrip p1ant, the coal-
plant located there, and using rate increases to
continue to prop up that plant. f'd like them to be
extremely transparent in how they intend to use
rate-payer doI.l-ars with regard to the plant there.
Again, looking online, it's rather evident that it's one
of the largest emitters of greenhouse gases in the
United States. And by happenstance, I've been both 1n
Houston and in Page in the last couple years, and I've
talked with folks at those l-ocations about their plants
and what they intend to do about them. So the l-ast
thing I would say is I do want them to continue to be
extremel-y transparent in what they do with the Colstrip
plant and with the money from rate payers, both with the
cleanup and with the phasing out of the plant. The
other utilities in Oregon and Washington appear to be
wanting to phase out by 2035. I can't find anything in
any of the lnformation that Avista has provided
regarding this matter as to when they wlsh to phase out
the plant and how do they intend to address the matter
of the cleanup. So thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And if
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we coul-d have you just remain there for a moment, Terry.
I've done enough of these public hearings that you would
think that I woul-d remember to recognize the official
appearances of the parties, because there is an
opportunity for them to ask what's referred to as
cross-examination. My sense is they will not have any
questions, but officially, for the record, we need to
get them recognized. So why don't we begin first with
Iega1 counse1 representing the staff of the Idaho Publ-ic
Utilities Commission.
MR. COSTELLO: My name is Sean Costel-l-o. I
represent staff in this matter.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And we also have,
from Avista
DAVID MEYER: Yes. Thank you. My name is
David Meyer, and we have also Pat Arehart, who is a
director of rates regulation, and our president of our
company Dennis Vermillion, and other representatives.
So if you do have questions afterwards, durj-ng a break,
we're happy to answer them. Thank you. And I won't be
cross-examining. I can't imagine what I would.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Is there any other
party with the case that needs to be officially
recognJ-zed for the record?
MATT NYKIEL: The Idaho Conservation League
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is here.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And just
officially, for the record, your name?
MR. NYKIEL: Matt Nykiel.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: And Matt, could
you spel1 your name?
MR. NYKTEL: Yes. M-a-t-t-h-e-w
N-y-k-i-e-1.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And
Terry, we made you stand for all that. So 1et me say
thank you again for your testimony, and we appreclate
it. And again, if you have any additional- comments
you'd l-ike to fi1e, please feel- free to do so.
MR. BOSTICK: Thank you for the opportunity.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. We' l-l-
cal-l- next Fl-orine Dooley. Florine, if you could raise
your right hand. Do you swear or affirm the testimony
you're about to provide will be the whol-e truth and
nothing but the truth?
ELORINE DOOLEY: I do.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And
we'11 have
General to
a few questions now from the Deputy Attorney
get
MR
your full name
you officially on the record.
COSTELLO: Ms. Dooley, can you state
and spe11 your l-ast name for the record?
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MS. DOOLEY: My Iega1 name is Georgia
Florine Dooley, G-e-o-r-g-i-a E-1-o-r-i-n-e D-o-o-1-e-y.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And what is your
resi-dence address?
MS. DOOLEY: I have lived in North Idaho
since 1965.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And
record, just in case we need to fo1Iow up
j ust
with
for
YOU,
down
the
do
foryou have a residence address that we
the record?
MS. DOOLEY: I also have
sj-nce Washington Water Power.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you
you'd like to make?
can take
been a customer
have a statementI
MS. DOOLEY: I can't hear you.
MR. COSTELLO: Do you have a statement you'd
like to make?
MS. DOOLEY: I do.
MR. COSTELLO: Go ahead.
MS. DOOLEY: So I've l-ived here since ' 65,
but I grew up in West Virginia, so f 'm sort of famil-iar
with coal mj-nes. I've had family and friends,
schoolmates, who l-ived on the sides of creeks who got
washed away from the Buffal-o floods, and they're stil-l
dealing with strip mining. So I have some concerns
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about Colstrip, and I, too, did some research. And I
see that here in your printout, you say that the l-aw
allows a reasonable income based on prudent expenses.
So I'd like to stress that. In Colstrip, they're basing
their production on coa1. There are only ei-ght years of
coal reserves }eft under the current system. The
solution that is being offered is a new strip mine. I
woul-d object to that. I question the prudence of
investing in a source of electricity -- and bel-ieve me,
I'm glad to have the lights come on when I flip the
switch, and it has since 1965, other than a storm or So,
or an ice storm. I question the prudence of lnvesting
j-n yet another way of producing electricity by coal.
f've not seen any answers. I read a l-ot. I've not seen
that prudence addressed. So I'Il- have a question or two
after the meeting. Okay. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And we
appreciate your statement this evening. Let's move now
to Deanna Wilson.
DEANNA WILSON: Hi.
you swear or
provide wil-1
truth?
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Hi, Deanna. Do
affirm the testimony you are about to
be the whol-e truth and nothing but the
MS. WILSON: Yes.
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Thank you.
you state
the record?your ful-l- name and spelI your last name
MS. WILSON: Deanna Wilson,D-e-a-n-n-a
W-i-I-s-o-n.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And what is your
residence address?
MS. WILSON: 1111 East Ade1ine Avenue, Coeur
d'Alene, 83814.
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
Avista Utilities?
MS. V{ILSON: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And do you have a
statement you'd l-ike to make?
MS. WILSON: Yes. Thank you to the
commission for having this hearing and being here, and
thank you to Avista for al-so belng here to l-isten. As
far as I can tell from my research and I apologize if
any of this is incorrect l, too, have concerns about
the money being used to invest in Colstrip, partj-cu1arly
I understand there may be other uses for the money with
regard to infrastructure. Erom my research, 1t looks
l-ike Portland General- Electric and Puget Sound Energy
are both making plans to puII out of Colstrip and phase
that out. Also Talon Energy, the plant's operator,
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER :
MR. COSTELLO: Ms. WiIson,can
for
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testified to the Montana state legislature that the coal-
plant has been loslng tens of millions dollars per year,
al-so a concern. So there's the economic part which is
that it seems not a great excuse me not a great
investment of the rate payers' money to prop up a
business thatrs obviously losing money. And f woul-d
l-ike to see that money go towards something that's more
economically and environmentally viable in the future.
Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. We
appreciate your statement. Ray Libby. Ray, do you
swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to
provide will be the whole truth and nothlng but the
truth?
RAY LIBBY: I
COMMISSIONER
MR. COSTELLO:
do.
KJELLANDER: Thank you.
Thank you. Can you state
your l-ast name for the record?your ful-l- name and spell
LIBBY:Raymond H. Lj-bby, R-a-y-m-o-n-d
L-i-b-b-y.
MR. COSTELLO: And what is your residence
addres s ?
MR. LIBBY: Address is 505 Sitting Bul-l
Road, Sandpoint, Idaho.
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
MR
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Avista?
MR. LIBBY: I am not.
MR. COSTELLO: Do you have a statement you'd
l-ike to make?
MR. LIBBY: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Please go ahead.
MR. LIBBY: Okay. Not being a customer of
Avista, although I do have property that is a customer,
so I'm indirectly invol-ved with the pay rates, but my
status here is simply we cannot afford to continue to
dis-acknowledge the fact that we need to get away from
coal- and fossil fuel-s. I know itf s a big topic, it's a
big arena, but this is just so1e1y my piece, and I think
it needs to be heard in as many voices as possible. You
know, economically or for whatever reasons, you know --
and she presents an excellent I don't have that
information for the economic reasons of not going with
the Colstrip there, but simply environmental- reasons.
We can't just keep going down this road. And I think
we're very short-sighted. And I know, without getting
too winded, that the viab1e alternatives are just coming
online and there's a lot of debate about that, but
therers no debate about fossil fuel-s contributing to the
dec1ine of life on earth on this planet, and I seriously
feel- we are two to three generations away from being
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endangered species. And you know, that being said, it's
a concern for me that we continue to support dny,
particularly ones such as this. That's my statement.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you for your
statement.
I've done so well with names. Chuck
Sheroke? Not even close, was l?
CHUCK SHEROKE: You were very c1ose.
Sheroke.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Sheroke. Okay.
Chuck would you raise your right hand? Do you swear or
affirm the testimony you are about to provide will be
the whol-e truth and nothing but the truth?
MR. SHEROKE: r do.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease state your full name
and spe11 your last name for the record.
MR. SHEROKE: Chuck Charles Sheroke,
S-h-e-r-o-k-e. I reside at 1,621 East Lost Avenue, Coeur
d'Alene, Idaho, and I am an Avista rate payer.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. Do you have a
statement?
MR. SHEROKE: Yes, I do. I want to thank
the commission for this opportunity to provide public
comment regarding Avista's latest of many requests fortPage 74
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rate increases 1n the proposed settlement that has been
proposed in this matter. Not to get off the subject, I
hope while the commission is here and commission staff,
they get an opportunity to see the eagles at Wolf Lodge
B.y, because it's quite a sight.
As you can see, I have an anti-coaI button
and I know a little bit about coal. My late father was
a coaf miner in Pennsylvania, and he died from
complications associated with bl-ack 1ung. I have two
major concerns regarding Avista's current proposal. The
first is Avista's continued involvement in Colstrip
unlts 3 and 4 and their significant impacts on the
environment, human heafth, and the potentially
significant costs imposed on rate payers, and that it is
not units 3 and 4 are not rel-iable generation
sources. The second issue f have is the inequitable
distrlbution of costs imposed on rate payers versus
stockholders, particularly in regards to Avista's
pending sal-e resulting in a financial windfal-l- to
institutional- investors and Avista management. First,
the environmental- effects. Coaf is the dirtiest form of
fossil fuel- energy and the single largest contributor to
globa1 climate change. Mercury, one of the several-
toxins emitted in this stew of pollutants, is
responsible for elevated mercury levels in our oceans
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resulting in heal-th advisories regarding fish
consumption. Respiratory probl-ems in humans and other
heal-th concerns have been l1nked to coal- plant
emissions. Cost to rate payers. Whil-e most util-ities
recognize a Colstrip is a di-nosaur in a financial
sinkhol-e, Avi-sta reguests millions of doLl-ars from rate
payers to maintain its interest in Colstrip and extend
its end of useful life to 2031. This bej-ng done despite
the fact that alternative energy and efflciency costs
are decreasing while coal- is becoming more and more
expensive. Moreover, Avista's integrated resource plan
does not take into account any money for clean-up of a
very contaminated Colstrip community and continues its
overdependence on fossil- fuels for generating facil-ities
whj-ch are not cost effective. The Washington State
Utility CommJ-ssion, while addressing Puget Sound
Energy's contlnued ownershlp interest in Colstrip,
decl,ared, "Puget Sound energy should not assume it wil-l
get relmbursed by Washington consumers for any more
expenditures at Colstrip. " Afso, PP&L, a CoJ-strip plant
operator, is spinning off and you heard this
before and is expected to lose 28 mil-l-ion over the
next 20 years at Colstrip. The Washlngton State Utility
Commission acceptance letter addresslng Avista's 2015
integrated resource plan and its conti-nued i-nvolvement
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in Colstrip declared at page \4, "Avista should continue
to evaluate scenarj-os rel-ated to contj-nued operation of
unit 3 and 4 of the coal power generating facility j-n
Colstrip, Montana. As a component of this evaluation,
Avista should provide an assessment of the impact of
rates on a hypothetical portfolio that does not incfude
these unj-ts. " Portland Genera1 Ef ectric is required to
be out of Colstrip by 2030. Talon Energy, the plant's
current operator, stated it is losing tens of millions
of dol-l-ars every year and is now seeking a loan from the
State of Montana to help keep the ol-der units
operational until- 2022. Unlt 4 has had several
breakdowns causing shutdowns since 2009. In 2073 to
2074, unit 4 had a breakdown which caused it to shut
down for over half a year. Who paid for that? Is that
rel-iable or 1s that cost ef fective? No, it's not.
Reliability, cost effectiveness of Avistars continued
invol-vement in Colstrip, must be adequately and
impartially addressed.
The inequitable di-stribution of cost to rate
payers versus stockholders. Avista's stockholders have
approved the sale of Avista to Hydro One, a Canadian
utility. Hydro is buying Avista stock for $53 a share,
whlch constltutes a 20-percent premium over the
company's closing price on July 79, which is the date
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that the safe was announced. The recent spat of
upgrades to Avista's generating facilities have
unquestionably increased the value of Avista's assets.
These upgrade costs are solely borne by rate payers
while stockhol-ders benefit financially and excl-usively.
Have these upgrades been expedited to accommodate the
sal-e of Avista?
Thatrs al-I I have to say. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you, and we
appreciate your statement. Thank you for your
testi-mony, Chuck.
Russ Hersrud?
RUSS HERSRUD: Hersrud.
Russ, if you
to testify,
questions,
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Hersrud.
could come forward.
MR. HERSRUD: I didn't realize I was
but here I am. I signed so I could
Okay.
going
ask
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get you to
afflrm the
the whole
but f can talk.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Russ, if f could
raise your ri-ght hand.
MR. HERSRUD: A1l- right.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Do you swear or
testimony you are about to provide will- be
truth and nothing but the truth?
MR. HERSRUD: To the best of my knowledge,
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yes.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And
we'11 see if the Deputy Attorney Genera1 has a few
questions to help get you on the record.
MR. COSTELLO: Can you state your fuIl name
and spell your l-ast name for the record?
MR. HERSRUD: Russel-l Stafford Hersrud,
H-e-r-s-r-u-d.
MR. COSTELLO: And what is your residence
address ?
MR. HERSRUD: lltl Woolsey Drive, Coeur
d'A1ene, Idaho 83816.
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
Avista?
MR. HERSRUD: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
you'd like to make?
MR. HERSRUD: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Go ahead.
MR. HERSRUD: Can I ask a question of these
gentlemen? Is that al-lowed?
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: During the break,
if you want to ask any questions, you can.
MR. HERSRUD: Okay. Listening to this
testimony like I said, I didn't plan on giving
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testimony, I planned to ask some questions, but we'lI do
that later. Listening to this testimony here, whi-ch I
agree with al-I of it, with the facts and figures, €t
cetera, et cetera, et cetera, I think we're missing
something. Irve got two grandkids. Looking at you
guys, you've probably got chil-dren and grandkids. Okay?
That's what we're talking about here. Their health.
This is an intergenerational- thing. ftrs not about me.
It's not about you. Itfs not about you. It's about the
people coming behind us. Vie northern European, whatever
we want to caII ourselves, seem to have a hard time
looking ahead beyond our nose. In example, I can
remember I'm that old in the 1960s when the
attorney general not the attorney general, the
health I think it was call-ed *- the health education
department came out and said that smoking causes cancer.
There were a thousand people Iined up to say he was out
to lunch. These thousand people, probably five hundred
of them died of cancer. However, they denied, they
denied, they denied. And that's what I'm hearing
constantly from organizations l-ike yours, that we don't
realIy have a problem, it's a bunch of erroneous
scientists and so forth. Wel-I, we've got a problem.
And it's not golng to affect me. It's going to affect
my grandkids and my great-grandkids. It's not a lack of
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factual evidence that you guys need to l-ook at. It's a
lack of your conscience. You need to take a hard look
at your conscience. If you can live with this kind of
damage, go for it. But not on my life. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And we
appreciate your testimony this evening. Let's see if we
can excuse me. I hate to say this, because I know
that there are a lot of things people say that you may
want to show some emotional support for, but this is
about getting this official-Iy in the record. So if you
could please l-ook at thls as you would a distri-ct court.
You wouldnrt clap in court, So please, I woul-d ask you
to restrain on any support or opposition to what
somebody may say.
So let's move forward. And Doug Fagerness?
Remotely close?
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: He went to the
bathroom.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: We wil-l- remember
to come back to Doug when he comes back to us. And
we'l-l- move into Emily Clevel-and. Emi-Iy, if you could
raise your right hand and see if I can find mine, dS
wel-l. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you are
about to provide will be the whole truth and nothlng but
the truth?
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EMILY CLEVELAND: I do.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
MR. COSTELLO: Will- you state your full name
and spe1I your l-ast name for the record?
MS. CLEVELAND: It's Emily Cleveland. My
last name is C-1-e-v-e-1-a-n-d.
MR. COSTELLO: And what is your residence
addres s ?
MS. CLEVELAND: Itrs t2l5 Superior Street,
Sandpoint, Idaho.
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
Avista?
MS. CLEVELAND: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
you'd lj-ke to make?
MS. CLEVELAND: Yes. And f'm also I also
work as the community engagement associate for Idaho
Conservation League. And first I'd like to thank the
commissioners for havj-ng this public hearing. I rea1ly
appreciate the opportunity for North Idahoans to be able
to have this opportunity to give public testimony on
this issue. ftrs something that's reaI1y important to a
lot of us, and so I appreciate you taking the time to
come up here and l-isten to us. And that goes to the
Avista staff here, ds wel-l-.
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On behal-f of my organization and 30,000
supporters we have in the state, I have concern about
the Colstrip coal--fired power plant and whether or not
that's a sound investment for Avista. There are a l-ot
of reasons for concern, but I think flrst and foremost
that people shoul-d be abl-e to be able to weigh 1n on how
their money is being spent, and that comes first with
transparency. And I've felt that in this process it was
reaIly difficul-t to discern how the money Avistars
putting towards Colstrip is actually being spent and
whether that money is going towards propping up this
plant and extending the useful Life. And so I would
l-ike to encourage Avista and encourage the commission to
think about that transparency and making sure the
customers can be able to see how their rate payer money
is going into these various investments. For example,
j-n the proposed rate increase, it l-isted $24,000,000 in
capital expenses for Colstrip between 2071 and 2019, and
it was unclear what of that percentage is being incl-uded
in this rate case, and it was interesting to understand
or to learn that part of that 1s going towards pollution
control that is not required and was put under a
mandatory expense, and that is also ineffective at
actually cleaning the air. So I think some of that
information could be a little more transparent for the
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customers and trying to understand how their money 1s
golng into this p1ant, this plant that many of these
customers are moral-Iy opposed to. And it's a difficult
thing to know that your money that your hard earned
money is going into something that you know you'11 be
facing the costs of in other ways, ds well, whether it's
increased smoke in the summertime with fires or other
effects of climate change. So I would just encourage
that Avista think about that transparency and make sure
that it's as clear as possible how theyrre investing
that rate payer money, and I woul-d encourage the
commj-ssion just to take a hard l-ook at Colstrip and
whether those investments are in the best interests of
Idahoans. One thing I l-earned today is that the CEO of
the Westmorel-and Coal Company resigned on Tuesday, and
that that coal- company who supplies the coal for
Colstrip it's the on-site mine is over
$300,000,000 in debt and their stock price has dropped
94 percent in the l-ast year. And so that, to me, is a
rea11y big red flag that this 1s somethj-ng that should
be taken with some cautj-on, and so I just I
appreciate the commission in looking out for the rate
payers, and I hope that they'Il take a hard look at
Colstrip. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. We
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appreciate your statement. Let's go back Doug, have
you are you here?
DOUG FAGERNESS: Too much information. I
was worried about that the whole time, actually.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: I have the same
feeling. It always happens to me. The best part about
that experience, though, is I usual-Iy speed up when I
talk and get done quicker.
MR. FAGERNESS: I shou1d have waited then,
right ?
o
way you're
withln reason.
hand?
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER :
prepared. You can go as
Doug, can I get you
That's fine. This
Iong as you want,
to ralse your right
MR. FAGERNESS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Do you
affirm the testimony you're about to provide
whole truth and nothing but the truth?
MR. EAGERNESS: I do.
swear or
will be the
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And
Doug, we have a couple of questions to help get you on
the record from the Deputy Attorney General-.
MR. COSTELLO: Can you state your ful1 name
and spell your l-ast name for the record?
MR. FAGERNESS: Yes. Douglas Paul
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Fagerness, F-a-g-e-r-n-e-s-s.
MR. COSTELLO: What is your resj-dence
address?
MR. FAGERNESS: 2L93 West Aviara Place,
Coeur d'Al-ene, Idaho .
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
Avista?
MR. FAGERNESS:Yes, I am.
And do you have a statementMR. COSTELLO:
you'd like to make?
MR. FAGERNESS: I do, please.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease go ahead.
MR. FAGERNESS: WeIl-, f j-rst, I wanted to
affirm what many have said. Gratitude for your taking
time and making this hearj.ng possible to hear from us
here in North Idaho. So thank you.
My background is early chifdhood education.
And so I guess the most compelling thing for me is
wondering about what will happen with our chil-dren and
for our children. So with that, I guess springboard, I
move forward. I was here long enough when Washlngton
Water Power was requesting rate increase to increase
their investment in nuclear power, the "Whoops" plant.
The Idaho Publ-ic Util-ities Commission at that time
denied that request. And as a result, our Washington
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Water Power became and sustained being a good investment
and was good for our rate payers. I appreciate the
emphasis on that conservation since Washington Water
Power and Avista has made. f can't I think it was
the threshold there, and we're at another threshold now,
and it's about coa1. I thlnk we have an opportunity to
move forward, move away from coal-, with wind and with
solar, and I sincerely hope we can take that advantage
and not continue reliance on a dinosaur, 1iteral1y. So
thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. We
appreciate your statement.
Matt and I'm not even
MATT NYKIEL: Nykiel.
COMM] SS]ONER KJELLANDER :
you coul-d raise your right hand. Do
the testimony you're about to provide
truth and nothing but the truth?
MR. NYKIEL: I do.
going to try.
Okay. Matt, if
you swear or affirm
will- be the whole
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And
couple questions to help get you on the record.
MR. COSTELLO: Will- you please state your
ful-l- name and spell your l-ast name for the record?
MR. NYKIEL: Matthew Nykiel, M-a-t-t-h-e-w
N-y-k-i-e-I.
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MR. COSTELLO: What is your residence
address ?
MR. NYKIELz 123 North Ell-a Avenue, Unit 7,
Sandpoint, Idaho.
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
Avi sta ?
MR. NYKIEL: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
you'd like to make?
MR. NYKIEL: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Go ahead.
MR. NYKIEL: I just want to start out and
echo, thank the commission and staff and Avista and
Avista staff , ds well , for taking the time to l-isten to
comments today. And another short quick note, just
about the hearing tonight. I just recommend that the
commission, in future hearings, rea11y takes a l-ittl-e
bit more time to advertise and get the word out a l-ittle
bit. There wasnrt a lot of notice in community
cal-endars or radio, public notices, and I think folks
rea11y do appreci-ate when the commission is here in
person and can hear comment from fol-ks in North ldaho,
and I know I've heard commission staff say that
sometimes the commission can be a l-ittle hesitant in
coming up here because these meetings can be thin at
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times, but I think the more we can get the word out, the
more people there are people interested in
participating. So just a friendly suggestion.
Rate cases provide an opportunity to
consider how Avista is spending its customers' money.
And in this case, we learn that Avista and its Idaho
customers wil-I be spending a significant amount of money
on the Colstrip coal-fired power p1ant. And in my view,
Colstrip isn't a good investment of Idahoan money, and
because of this Ird encourage the commission and its
staff to more critically evaluate Avista's financial
expenditures at the plant in this rate case and the rate
cases that wil-l fol-l-ow. Coal plants throughout the
country are like a fleet of sinking ships, and Colstrip
is no different. More than 250 coal plants throughout
the country have retired since 2070. And as stated in a
Forbes articl-e this past May, the central thread in
util-ity decisions to retire coal- plants is that coal is
increasingly priced out of the power markets by natural
gas and renewables or made obsolete by shrj-nking demand.
The expense of coal power is relative. Renewables and
natural gas are in many cases cost competitlve if not
less expensive than coal-, and the expense of coal also
comes from additional costs unique to burning fossil-
fuel-s and co-owning such a large facility with multiple
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owners. As part of this f l-eet of sinking coal- plants in
our country, Colstriprs unique addltional costs are like
leaks springing into a ship, and Avista is trying to
paper over them with hundred thousand dol-1ar biIls, and
I just don't think that is a good use of Idahoan money.
So for example, coal ash ponds at the facility have
leaked and theyrve contaminated the locaI groundwater in
the town of Colstrip, and preliminary estimates indicate
that just the first stage of cleanup may cost upwards of
$138,000,000 and itrs anticipated that the second and
third stages of cleanup will be more expensi-ve than the
first.
On a separate note, other coal_-owning
util-ities are setting the stage to end their use of the
p1ant. For example, two Oregon-based util-ities that
part-own Colstrip with Avista will be 1egaIIy prohibited
from distributing power from that plant by 2030 or 2035.
And Puget Sound Energy, which is a predominant
sharehol-der of the plant 2S-percent ownership in
units 3 and 4 -- is in settlement negotiations that if
finalized woul-d require PSE to be financially prepared
to end its use of units 3 and 4 by 2027.
In addition to a1l- these costs, Avista's
application in this rate case indicates that Avista has
been spending rate payer money on what, in my opinion,
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are risky and speculative capital expenditures at
Colstrip without providing the public and the commission
much explanation or analysis of why they chose to do so.
And it's come to our attention that similar speculative
expendltures at Colstrip were included but perhaps not
clearly explicated in the prior rate case to this one.
And so going forward and understanding the tenuous
circumstances and economics of Colstrip, f'd request
that the commission and 1ts staff scrutinize closely any
expenditures at Colstrip that Avista requests in the
rate cases to come, and I woul-d request the commission
encourage Avista to be more forthcoming with information
that will help customers understand how and why their
money is being invested in this facility. Thanks.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And
Matt, a1so, in reference to the one of the age ol-d
probJ-ems that we run into is trying to figure out the
best way to get the word out that we're having a public
hearlng. So if you would meet with Matt Evans and I
know you've met Matt. He's our public information
officer. If you have some thoughts or ideas every
community is a littl-e different, every region of the
state is a little different. f know he'd be more than
willing and eager to hear your thoughts about ways 1n
which we might be better about getting the word out.
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MR. NYKIEL: creat. Will do.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
MR. NYKIEL: Thanks.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: All right. I'm
sorry. Michael- FuIler or Full-en?
MR. FULLER: Pufl-er.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Ful-l-er.
MR. FULLER: Yes, sir.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: If you could raise
your right hand. Do you swear or affirm the testimony
you are about to provide will be the whol-e truth and
nothj-ng but the truth?
MR. FULLER: f do, sj-r.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And if
we could get a couple of questions from the attorney
general to get you officially on the record.
MR. COSTELLO: Wil-l- you please state your
full name and spe1I your l-ast name for the record?
MR. FULLER: My name is Michael R. Fuller,
F-u-1-l--e-r.
MR. COSTELLO: And what is your residence
addre s s ?
MR. FULLER: 1507 Fairmont Loop, here in
Coeur d'Alene.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And are you a
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customer of Avista?
MR. FULLER: Yes, I am. I have several
accounts with Avista in Coeur d'AIene and Sandpoint.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And do you have a
statement you'd Like to make?
MR. FULLER: Yes, I do.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease go ahead.
MR. FULLER: Wel-l-, once agaj-n, thank you for
being here Avlsta and commissioners. I've served on
commissions in the state of Montana in my past, and I
know it's sometimes a thankless job, but one that's very
important to hear the voice of the people. I was born
and raised J-n Montana, as I've stated. I was in
southern Montana going to school- when Colstrip was first
developed in the early 70s. And I saw a fot of things
happen there that were reaIly concerning to me, both for
workers and for people in the community, people that
were injured during the constructlon of the plant,
people who suffered pain and suffering through the early
stages of it, and I know the community still has a lot
of concerns about the wel-I being of the community.
Also, having been a Montana native, f know what's
happened in Libby, Montana, what's happened in Butte,
what's gone on in Missoula prior to cleaning up a lot of
the wood mil-Is plants in the Missoula area, but ongoing
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issues with Libby in the cleanup, ongoing issues with
Butte, Montana and the mining operations there. That
was 40 years ago. Hard to believe. I was a college
student in southern Montana. And it's striklng to me
that we cannot rea11y appreciate the technol-ogy that's
happened that's brought us from 40 years ago to develop
the energy we all need to survi-ve and to prosper, and
we're still leaning back on that potentlally with
development and the contlnuing support of the Colstrip
plant. It's pretty apparent to me that climate change
and the development of coal- is an age ol-d industry. I
personally believe that al-ternative energy is and I
support Avistaf s program with bl-ock wj-nd and power
payments on my account, which I thought was kind of
amazing. I was just going to drop one of my Avista
bills in the box over here on 4th on the way here, so
I'm stil-I supporting Avista. I think itrs a great
organization. And they treated me wel-l. When gas came
to my area of Coeur d'Alene, which is a l-ittl-e on the
perimeter, we were one of the first to sign up because
we love cooking with gas. Avi-sta's gas is great. It
was a big factor for us buying and living where we live
j-n the Coeur d'Al-ene area, to have gas to cook with, and
they were very good, and to get into was very
reasonabl-e. So we now have that instead of propane. So
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thanks, Avista, for that.
One of the things that I noted in the back
of the l-ittle handout we had here is my question to
Avlsta is a utility submits burden of proof
demonstrating the additional expense as j-ncurred is
necessary to serve customers and prudently incurred.
I'd like to rea11y ask everyone else here this question
of whether or not it's prudent to contj-nue to support a
plant that has really met its age and is a dj-nosaurr ds
so many people have commented. There are much better
ways to produce the energy we're going to need in the
future, and I'm looking forward to many more years with
Avista contlnuing to provide my power. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And we
appreciate your statement.
Art Piltch, do you swear or affirm the
testimony you're about to provide will be the whol-e
truth and nothing but the truth?
ART PILTCH: I do.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
MR. COSTELLO: Please state your full name
and speIl your last name for the record.
MR. PILTCH: Arthur Piltch, P-i-I-t-c-h.
MR. COSTELLO: And your residence address?
MR. PILTCH: 87 Rock Road, Sandpoint.
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MR. COSTELLO: Are you a customer of Avista?
MR. PILTCH: Yes, I am.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
you'd like to make?
MR. PILTCH: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease go ahead.
MR. PILTCH: I'm opposed to the rate hike
being requested by Avista. I have seen in Avista's
latest integrated resource plan that they plan on
keeping their share in the Colstrip coal-fired
generators and keeping these plants operational for the
next 20 years. I understand from testimony of Ben Otto
of the Idaho Conservation League that the rate increase
is needed for further investments in the Colstrip plant
and to pay for a share of Smart Burn technology which is
supposed to reduce the amount of nitrogen oxides and
agents produced by the facility. The testimony incl-uded
expert opinion that the Smart Burn technology is not
only not required by law, but is ineffective in reducing
pollution. Most j-mportant to me is that it does nothing
to address the huge amount of greenhouse gas emitted by
these plants. It is obvious to me, ds well as most
people on Earth and the entire community of cl-imate
scientists, that we need to take immediate steps to
reduce greenhouse emissions or face a catastrophic
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future. We have seen an alarming increase in fires in
the west since the I910s that has been associated with
increasingly 1ong, hot, dry summers and early snow melt.
The rest of the nation or the rest of the worl-d have
been experienclng more frequent and severe droughts,
heat waves, extreme storms and flooding, sea-Ievel-wise
is on a course to make the coastal areas where much of
the world's population lives, uninhabitable. When
considering what energy choices to invest in now, how
can we not take into account the cost and suffering that
not adjusting to climate change will- impose on our
future. There are clean energy options avalfabl-e that
coul-d replace the electricity f rom the CoJ-strip pIant.
For example, the same area of Montana that provides coal
to Colstrip is among the best in the country for wind
resources. Wind-generated electricity can be
transmitted to Avista customers along the same power
lines that now bring us power from Colstrip. The other
utilities that own shares in Colstrip have plans to
dj-vest. They apparently don't agree with Avista's
assessment that maintaining the Colstrip facility makes
any economic sense. As members of the Idaho Publ-ic
Utilities Commission charged with looking after the best
interests of Avista customers who are Idaho residents, I
urge you to reject this request for a rate increase. I
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would not be opposed to a rate increase if instead it
were being used to invest in clean energy. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you for your
statement. We appreciate that.
We'11 cal-I now Suzanne Marshall. Do you
swear or affj-rm the testimony you are about to provlde
wil-l- be the whol-e truth and nothing but the truth?
SUZANNE MARSHALL: Yes.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl_ease state your name for
the record.
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N/Iq
MR.
MS.
MR.
MARSHALL:
COSTELLO:
MARSHALL:
COSTELLO:
Suzanne Marshal-l-.
And your residence address?
620 North 16th, CDA, 83814.
And are you a customer of
Avista?
MS. MARSHALL: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
you'd l-ike to make?
MS. MARSHALL: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease go ahead.
MS. MARSHALL: Yes. I just moved here a
couple years d9o, and I do love North Idaho, and I
particularly like its cl-ean air. I happen to be a
person who suffers from asthma, and so it's sort of a
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personal thing. I'm wearing this coal button where I'm
against coal-. I grew up in a house partly in western
Kentucky that burned coal, so I wonder if that had
something to do with the asthma. And then I lived in
eastern Kentucky when my husband was in medical school,
where he saw Iots of patients with black lung and all
sorts of respiratory illnesses, so I've become aware of
sort of the medical effects, health effects of coa1.
And so when I began to read about Avista's interest in
continuing to run the Colstrip plant for another
until- 2031 , I was concerned about that, because j-t's a
3O-year-o1d plant and I woul-d prefer that my money be
spent on better energy sources and not be used on, like
other people already said, a dinosaur. And so that's
what my concern is. I have asthma. I know what it's
like. Kids get it. Itrs an effect of coal-fired
plants, and so I think that would be something Avista
might want to take into account. I also thank you for
coming here. This is my first public meeting 1n ldaho,
although I've been to many in other states, and so it's
nice that you came up to way up Irm not used to
how big this state is. You came clear up here to l-isten
to uSr and I appreclate that. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you for your
statement. I appreciate you showlng up this evening, as
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otrLJ
WCII
We have Linda Sanders.
LINDA SANDERS: First f have a book I want
to recommend to everyone.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Linda, could we
get you sworn in first? If you coul-d raise your right
hand. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about
to provide wil-l be the whol-e truth and nothing but the
truth?
MS. SANDERS: Yes.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. And we
have a couple of questions from the Deputy Attorney
General to help get you on the record.
MR. COSTELLO:t
MS. SANDERS:
Post Fa1Is, fdaho.
customer of Avista?
you'd l-ike to make?
MS. SANDERS:
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And are you a
Can you state your full name
for the record?
Linda Sanders.
And your residence address?
l'725 North Stagecoach Drive,
and spe1I your
MS.
MR.
Iast name
SANDERS:
COSTELLO:
MS. SANDERS: Yes
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
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MR. COSTELLO: Please go ahead.
MS. SANDERS: First I want to recommend this
book for the latest information on climate change
written by a wonderful Native Amerj-can young man of 71
years old. Anyway, he's leading a movement called "The
Earth Guardians' Guide to Bullding a Movement that
Restores the Planet. " Climate change 1s real-. Human
beings have caused it. We've known about the
relationship between carbon dioxide and 91oba1 warming
since the 1890s. For about 50 years, coal burning has
been belching tons of greenhouse gases into our air
every day. Avista has been participating in this
pollution by using a mj-x of energy including 10 percent
coal. Along wlth other dirty energy producers, Avlsta
has been Iagging behind in dealing with climate change.
Surely, Avista can replace the 10 percent energy from
Colstrip coal in Montana to clean solar or wind power
generated local1y. It woul-d be a wise change both
financially and environmentally. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. We
have exhausted the names that were on the l-ist we have.
Is there anyone else that would like to testlfy this
evening?
Why don't you go ahead and just move up to
the podium and we'l-l- get you sworn in. If you could
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raise your right hand. Do you swear or afflrm the
testimony you are about to provide will- be the whole
truth and nothing but the truth?
KRISTI MILAN: Yes.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER :
a few questions to get you
Thank you. And
officially on thewe'11 have
record.
MR. COSTELLO: Wil-l- you state your ful-l- name
and spelI your last name for the record?
MS. MILAN: Kristi-, K-r-i-s-t-i, Mi1an,
M-i-l--a-n.
MR. COSTELLO: Thank you. And your
residence address?
MS. MILAN: 1310 Coeur d'A1ene Avenue, Coeur
d'Al-ene, Idaho, 83814.
MR. COSTELLO: And are you a customer of
Avista?
MS. MILAN: I sure am.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
you would l-ike to make?
MS. MILAN: I do.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease go ahead.
MS. MILAN: I actually only heard about this
meeting last yesterday, and so f don't have a long
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prepared statement, but I've gathered several thoughts
as f l-istened to other people. I'm a retired teacher.
I am a mother of three. Two of my sons l-ive here in
Kootenai County, and I am a Nana of five who all live
here, and I'm very concerned about the environment and
their living conditions. I'm a history retired
history teacher, and my belief is that we need to learn
from history. And unfortunately, it seems like a l-ot of
times we are not. If we remember correctly, when we
used to smoke on planes and pretend that in the back of
the plane that the smoke woul-dn't affect us if we were
j.n the front of the p1ane. In mal-l-s and in cars. In
history, we remember that there was a big fi-ght over
whether or not we should switch from horses to cars, and
the pollution that it would keep. Last month f am
active at the Kootenai Environmental All-iance, and we
had a water keepers fil-m festival which there was a film
about the dams in the Washington peninsula and the
effort to tear down those dams, because they were no
longer the source of electricity for the town on the
peninsula, and the reason they coul-d tear those down was
because of more efficient ways of providing energy. And
that's what we need to l-ook into is the fact is is that
history wil-l- show that coal is dead, and it's not only
dead, but it is causing incredible pollution. ft's not
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onl-y causing pollution as we burn it, but it is causing
pollution as we mine it, it is causing poJ-Iution to
those who mine it, and it is causing destruction all-
along the wdy, and it is time that we get rid of it.
Science doesn't 1ie.
I will- admit that I am under the belief that
utilities should be for the pubJ-ic good, that they
reaIly shouldn't be making a profit, and that
sharehol-ders shoul-d not be the end al-l- as to how a
utility, a public utility, shoul-d be making its money,
that 1t should be for the public good and not for the
shareholders. We have to change. We have to make the
change, and we have to l-ook in the future, and we have
to invest 1n the future. We cannot continue to l-ook at
a product that will be extinct and wll-l- not be viabl-e 1n
the future. f've noticed that aI1 the people here that
have spoke up have been against the coal-. ft is for our
benefit that we do not use Avista's money to invest 1n a
source of energy that w1l-l not be viable in the future.
We need to j-nvest in the future. And we in history,
it says that if we do not l-earn from history, that we
are doomed to repeat it. And I would hope that you do
not repeat it.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you for your
statement this evening. Is there anyone else who would
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l-ike to testify? If not
STEPHANIE HALLOCK:I ' Il- testif y.
Wefl-, we got a
oh
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER :
taker.
MS. HALLOCK: I wasn't going
brave, I guess.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: ]f
you raise your right hand. Do you swear
testimony you are about to provide will
truth and nothlng but the truth?
MS. HALLOCK: Yes.
Apartment 95, 1n Coeur d'Afene.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER :
you to spe11 your l-ast name one more
more slowly for me.
MS. HALLOCK: Okay. It's
COMMI SS ]ONER KJELLANDER :
to, but I ' l-l be
I could have
or afflrm the
be the whole
t
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you.
MR. COSTELLO: Will you state
and speI1 your l-ast name for the record?
MS. HALLOCK: Itrs Stephanie
last name is H-a-I-l--o-c-k.
address ?
your fuI1 name
HaIIock, and my
MR. COSTELLO: And what is your residence
MS. HALLOCK: It's 2501 East Sherman Avenue,
And could
time, just
T ask
a Iittl-e
H-a-l--1-o-c-k.
Okay. -o-c-k.And
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your first name?
MS. HALLOCK: Stephanle.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you,
Stephanie. Sorry to interrupt.
MR. COSTELLO: Are you a customer of Avista?
MS. HALLOCK: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: And do you have a statement
you'd like to make?
MS. HALLOCK: Yes.
MR. COSTELLO: Pl-ease go ahead.
MS. HALLOCK: f've been a customer with
Avista for 13 years, and any time there's a rate
increase, it affects obviousl-y all of us economically.
And I know I have a lot of friends that are living
paycheck to paycheck, so when theyrre talking about rate
increases, that concerns me. I know that in the past,
Avista has had to pay for like mi-tigation with their
re-l-icenslng, and they have to do stuff with like the
Coeur d'A1ene Trj-be on Lake Coeur d'Alene, and thatrs
mil-]ions of dol-lars that are and some of our rate
payer money is obvj-ousl-y going to that. And I don't
mind my rate payer money to going to stuff that benefits
me 1oca11y. I recreate on the l-ake all- of us do
and I wouldn't mind if thlngs are protected from bank
erosion and et cetera. But to me, this proposed plan to
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invest in coal does not benefit me. Like many here, I
be1ieve that we should be looking for future. There's a
lot of renewabl-e energies we need to invest in, and
there's alternatj-ve energies. It's sort of an exciting
time because there's this time where all these it's
not just people here in the U.S., but all over the
wor1d, there's dlfferent countries that are going to be
investing and researching different technologies, so it
doesn't make sense for the people in the state of Idaho
to having our rate payer money going to an industry that
is like many people said, it's a dying industry, and
the future is in these renewable energies because and
al-ternative energies. So I personally, if I had a
way I naively didn't realize how much Avista is
investing in coal. If I had my way, I would choose a
utility that didn't invest anything i-n coal-, because to
fre, that's just like many said, it's increasing our
greenhouse gases. Climate change is going to be a big
thing. So I wish that f had a way to not invest have
my rate payer money go at all to anything with coal,
period. But in this case, since I can't choose my
utility, I would since I don't have a cholce, I would
like to say that I don't support any investing a rate
payer increase to go toward investing more into the
strip coal or whatever j.t's caIIed, their proposed
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pl-ans. I lust think that that's not a good choice
economj-ca11y and mora11y, too. So thanks.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you, and we
appreciate your testimony.
Why don't we go ahead and you move up to the
podium and we'l-l have you raj-se your right hand. Do you
swear or affirm the testimony you are about to provide
wil-l be the whol-e truth and nothing but the truth?
SHIRLEY BLACKWELL: I do.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you. We
have a coupJ-e questions from the Deputy Attorney General
to get you on the record.
MR. COSTELLO: WilI you state your full- name
and spelI your l-ast name for the record?
MS. BLACKWELL: Shirley Ann 81ackwell,
B-1-a-c-k-w-e-1-1, 1620 West Canfield Avenue, Coeur
d'AIene, 83815.
MR.
Me.,.) .
MR.
like to make?
COSTELLO:
BLACKWELL:
COSTELLO:
Are you a customer of Avista?
I am.
Do you have a statement you'd
MS. BLACKWELL: Yes, thank you. So many
things you've stated, Ifve read and studied, and I
totally agree with everything that people have said.
One thing that has not been mentioned, which I think is
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real-1y important for wise investment, that pays good
divldends for our future here in Coeur d'Al-ene, is what
I've studied in the book by Carl Pope and Michael-
Bloomberg in "Climate of Hope." And they start out
Bloomberg, of course, is very staunch Republican
conservative, and CarI Pope is the former director of
the Sierra Club. And they've come together to make
dollars and sense. And the dollars and sense that
Bloomberg talks about, being the former mayor of New
York several- times over, he coul-d see that it was not
wise investment to invest in a dinosaur and things that
were absolutely not good investment for the community in
itself on a small scafe from grass roots up, that wlth
our beautiful town here of Coeur d'Alene and thls whole
northwest area, it would make much more dol-l-ars and
sense, whether you're a Republican, Democrat,
Independent, whatever, to provide an environment that
wou1d attract families and business. Most people today
are more wel-l- educated about this subject, and they
don't want to bring their famil-ies here if they know
that we are golng to continue along with this dinosaur
polluting our air and our water and our natural-
resources. So for business investment and good
dividends, long-term, Iong-term, 1t woul-d be wj-se to
invest in sustainabl-e development and our environment to
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attract business that wil-l pay for our future and our
schools and our cl-ean air and our water and our l-and.
It makes dollars and sense. Simple as that. Thank you.
COMMISSIONER KJELLANDER: Thank you for your
statement. Is there anyone else who would l-ike to
provide a statement this evening? If not, w€ are to
that point at which I woul-d l-ike to remind everyone that
the next step in this proceeding is for the technical
hearing on the proposed settlement which wil-1 occur on
December 8, and that date wil-l- al-so represent the cl-ose
of public comments for this caser So therers still time
j-f there's other things that you think of that you want
to submit to be a part of the official public record,
that you can do so up until December 8.
I would also l-ike to say thank you to School
District 217 for making this facility available to us.
They were very generous. If you couId, if you did bring
anything in with you, take it out. It's sort of a
courtesy to make sure that we don't leave anything
behind. Again, they've been very generous. And as far
as facil-ities go, this is one of the nicer ones that
werve been able to deal- with in terms of being able to
just wal-k in, have a public hearing and have comfortable
seating. So again, I want to thank District 211 for
their generous offering of allowing us to be here this
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evenr-ng.
I know that there are some people that had
some questions of the utility, and I believe they said
that they'd be avail-able for some O and A. And I know
that we have some staff membersr ds we1l. If you have
procedural questj-ons, that's about the only thing that I
can deal with, because I serve as an adjudicator over
this case. So j-f you ask me a question and I give you a
blank stare, it's because frm supposed to give you a
blank stare. That's my role in this. I speak
official-Iy through our orders, So we'11 be looking at
the case going forward.
And with that, then that concludes this
segment of the process of the public hearing. And
again, I want to thank everybody, too. At a time 1n
which we talk a lot about the l-ack of civil discourse, I
think you demonstrated this evening that there is quite
the ability to agree to disagree without being
disagreeabl-e, and I really do appreciate your
willingness to come forward and to present, in a very
civil fashion, your comments, thoughts and statements
this evening. So thank you.
And with that, we are adjourned.
(Hearing adjourned at 7:05 p.m. )
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REPORTER' S CERT]FICATE
I, JULIE MCCAUGHAN, Certified Shorthand Reporter,
do hereby certify:
That the foregoing proceedings were taken
before me at the tlme and place therein set forth;
That the proceedings were recorded
stenographically by me and were thereafter transcribed
by me or under my direction;
That the foregoing is a true and correct
record of the proceedings, to the best of my ability;
That I am not a relative or employee of
any of the parties.
IN WITNESS WHEREOE, I have hereunto set my
hand and seaf Dec 8, 2071 .
JULIE MC GHAN, rD C.S.R.o. 684Notary PubIic
816 Sherman Avenue, Suite 1
Coeur d'Al-ene, ID 83814
My Commission Expi-res May l, 2022.
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apologize4:9 11:18
apparent 34:10
apparently 37:20
appear 6:19
appearances 7:4
application 1:3 3:16
30:24
appreciate 5: 19 8: 1 1
10:18 12:11 18:10
2l:6 22:20,23 24:22
25:.l 27:2,t2 2
34:5 35:15 38:
39:23,25 4B:4
approved 77:.22
area 33:25 34:L9,23
37'.14 49:L5
areas37i7
Arehart 7:16
arena 13:13
Art 35: 16,19
Arthur 35:23
article 29:17
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scientists 20'.23 36 : 24
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services 5: 19
set 52:5,13
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severe 37:5
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shareholder 30:19
shareholders 44:9,12
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sustaanable 49:25
sustained 27:1
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technologies 47:8
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